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Sekerob
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Re: Not sure how much longer they will be able to keep crunching in the UK

That Botulinum injection was a gift... for those who can fold their cranial flex around this:

The Biggest Control Knob: Carbon Dioxide in the Earth's Climate History

It's easy and it's presented with a little LoL, so it should be pleasing.
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[Jan 31, 2010 6:05:25 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
retsof
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Re: Not sure how much longer they will be able to keep crunching in the UK

It's strong stuff this catastrophic Man Made Global Warming in the face of the inactive Sun


disproving that second thought, obviously the only source of colder weather in the U.K.

http://sohowww.nascom.nasa.gov/pickoftheweek/old/29jan2010/




Extensions into the Upper Solar Atmosphere (January 29, 2010)

With two active regions (brighter areas) in profile almost diametrically apart, SOHO got a good view of the extensive areas above the Sun influenced by the powerful magnetic fields associated with the two regions. This wavelength of extreme ultraviolet light "sees" ionized iron heated to 2 million degrees in the upper solar atmosphere. The hotter the temperature, the higher you look in the solar atmosphere. Although the image is rather diffuse, we can more clearly see in other wavelengths that material is tracing arcs of magnetic field lines looping above the active regions. Just a few months ago, the large-scale solar magnetic field was like that from a bar magnet, and flattened along the Sun's equator. Now, it's not much more complicated in shape, but it's tilted, as seen by the position of these two regions --- a clear giveaway that the rise to solar maximum has begun.

a clear giveaway that the rise to solar maximum has begun.
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[Edit 3 times, last edit by retsof at Feb 1, 2010 2:31:42 PM]
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retsof
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Re: Not sure how much longer they will be able to keep crunching in the UK

In addition since 1993 Catalytic Converters have been required by American and EU law which means that our cars now do not produce very much else at their exhausts other than CO2.
Another combustion product and component of smog, nitrogen dioxide, comes to mind.

Nitrogen dioxide is toxic by inhalation, but this could be avoided as the material is acrid and easily detected by our sense of smell. Symptoms of poisoning (lung edema) tend to appear several hours after one has inhaled a low but potentially fatal dose. Also, low concentrations (4 ppm) will anesthetize the nose, thus creating a potential for overexposure.

Note yet another trace gas effect at four parts per million.

The most important sources of NO2 are internal combustion engines, thermal power stations and, to a lesser extent, pulp mills. Butane gas heaters and stoves are also sources. The excess air required for complete combustion of fuels in these processes introduces nitrogen into the combustion reactions at high temperatures and produces nitrogen oxides (NOx). Limiting NOx production demands the precise control of the amount of air used in combustion.

Nitrogen dioxide is also produced by atmospheric nuclear tests, and is responsible for the reddish colour of mushroom clouds.

Nitrogen dioxide is a large scale pollutant, with rural background ground level concentrations in some areas around 30 µg/m3, not far below unhealthy levels. Nitrogen dioxide plays a role in atmospheric chemistry, including the formation of tropospheric ozone. A 2005 study by researchers at the University of California, San Diego, suggests a link between NO2 levels and Sudden Infant Death Syndrome.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nitrogen_dioxide

http://yosemite.epa.gov/opa/admpress.nsf/d0cf...75e40068b819!OpenDocument

Trace denyers will love this one, a one HOUR exposure limit in parts per billion:

For the first time in more than 35 years, EPA has proposed to strengthen the nation’s nitrogen dioxide (NO2) air quality standard that protects public health. The proposed changes reflect the latest science on the health effects of exposure to NO2, which is formed by emissions from cars, trucks, buses, power plants, and industrial facilities and can lead to respiratory disease.

EPA’s proposed revisions apply to the primary NO2 standard and would:

* establish, for the first time, a one-hour NO2 standard at a level between 80 – 100 parts per billion (ppb),
* retain the current annual average NO2 standard of 53 ppb,
* add NO2 monitoring within 50 meters of major roads in cities with at least 350,000 residents, and
* continue monitoring “area-wide” NO2 concentrations in cities with at least 1 million residents.
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[Edit 5 times, last edit by retsof at Feb 1, 2010 2:26:40 PM]
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retsof
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Re: Not sure how much longer they will be able to keep crunching in the UK

nitrous oxide absorbs much more energy than CO2 (about 270 times as much)

http://science.howstuffworks.com/global-warming3.htm

Nitrous oxide (NO2) is another important greenhouse gas. Although the amounts being released by human activities are not as great as the amounts of CO2, nitrous oxide absorbs much more energy than CO2 (about 270 times as much). For this reason, efforts to curb greenhouse gas emissions have focused on NO2 as well [Source: Soil Conservation Council of Canada]. The use of large amounts of nitrogen fertilizer on crops releases nitrous oxide in great quantities, and it is also a by-product of combustion.
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by retsof at Feb 1, 2010 4:28:48 PM]
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David Autumns
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Re: Not sure how much longer they will be able to keep crunching in the UK

"a clear giveaway that the rise to solar maximum has begun"

retsof this is the case

which means

we have just bottomed out of a solar minima

which

is a currently inactive Sun

Hence the copious amounts of snow right now in the 2010 NH Winter

something that is likely to persist over the next couple of years as 2008 and 2009 have had the least number of Sunspots (and hence Solar Activity) since 1911 (You know back when the Planet was.....colder ) and the Oceans act as a huge Hot Water bottle for the earth smoothing out these changes in our Climate.



NO2 is a brown gas (the brown smog sometimes seen over cities) this is a green house gas however being brown it directly blocks out the Sunlight where it is present

Since 1993 catalytic converters have become the norm and again this by-product of combustion is no longer present in our car exhaust gases.

Our Sky's are clearer (less brown) and more Sunlight reaches the ground and once again warming is the result

All of these effects have to be taken into account before the finger is pointed at CO2, the clear non-toxic trace gas making up just 0.0388% of our atmosphere responsible - through photosynthesis - for all life on earth, as the culprit in the 20th Centuries warming


Dave
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Re: Not sure how much longer they will be able to keep crunching in the UK

"All of these effects have to be taken into account before the finger is pointed at CO2, the clear non-toxic trace gas making up just 0.0388% of our atmosphere responsible - through photosynthesis - for all life on earth, as the culprit in the 20th Centuries warming

Trace things can have profound effects. We have demonstrated this with numerous examples. You have yet to provide any counter-example or counter-argument, but insist on endlessly parroting the percentage of CO2. Your trivial fact proves nothing.
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David Autumns
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Re: Not sure how much longer they will be able to keep crunching in the UK

indeed

You have proved that poisons are poisons

What you haven't proved is that a clear odourless non-toxic gas that makes up just 0.0388% of our atmosphere is having any measurable effect whatsoever on our Climate when all other variables and feedbacks are taken into account

This, with our current state of knowledge of the planetary climate, is impossible to do

Let me know when you can.


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Sekerob
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Re: Not sure how much longer they will be able to keep crunching in the UK

One of my long time favorites pulled up from the library: Jethro Tull, part 1 and 2 of Thick as a Brick. . On checking just now found it won a British Grammy, the concept build upon a poem by an intelligent English boy facing the trials of growing up... and that tough steep learning curve of live. Very much applies to the 21st century children who're recommended to visit http://climate.nasa.gov/kids/ to gain some knowledge with an actual scientific base and seek out via Google what Arctic Oscillation -3.41 does.
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Re: Not sure how much longer they will be able to keep crunching in the UK

indeed

You have proved that poisons are poisons

I have proven that trace things can have measurable and profound effects on systems. You claim that they cannot.

What you haven't proved is that a clear odourless non-toxic gas that makes up just 0.0388% of our atmosphere is having any measurable effect whatsoever on our Climate when all other variables and feedbacks are taken into account

IPCC proved this, and took all other variables and feedbacks into account.

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David Autumns
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Re: Not sure how much longer they will be able to keep crunching in the UK

Ah the IPCC says it is so

Therefore it must be correct


laughing


Don't even get me started wink

If you want to remain credible you are going to need another source


All that "peer reviewed science" biggrin
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