What I am trying to do is to do nothing truly new, just avail ourselves of what we have always had the ability to do. If we are really fed up with this problem, there is MUCH we can contribute to its demise without anything really new. No new tools. No new processes. I would much prefer that we try to take a consistent approach to the problem and one that gives the poster the benefit of the doubt. We've all been in ozylynx's shoes - the unintentional goof. Heck, I did that just the other day right here in this very thread. By simply pointing out to the user the problem with their post, allowing them to fix it and then removing our post raising the issue, the problem gets resolved, the user gets to resolve it themselves, there's no potential "embarasssment" of being "nelsoc'd", and there's nothing for those that post later to react to. Doing all this in a respectfull manner is the key. If IBM and the admins want to do more, they certainly can but I see nothing that says we can't address the problem ourselves. If anything, we as a community will likely be able to address the problem faster than IBM or the admins can. I have no problem with the CA's getting authority to edit posts but I expect that that will prove to be a mistake, not because they will misuse it but because how some could and probably will perceive it. What I suggest is nothing that the CA's can't participate in. It's open to everyone. It just a matter of folks committing to do it and to try to do so in as much of a consistent manner as possible. Profanity in posts will be clear cut to deal with as will blatent personal attacks. Posts that can be misinterpreted, as was the case with ozylynx, will not be so clear cut and probably should not be addressed if and until they prove to be an issue.

Currently, a user makes a post, let's say in an emotional reaction to something and there's a clear personal attack ("You're an idiot that doesn't know what you're talking about!" for example). Today, folks see that and react to it, usually defensively if not equally offensively. What I suggest would mean that, hopefully, very soon after the initial post appears, it would have a reply politely pointing out the rule violation, asking that they edit their post to address that, and note that this reply will be removed once they do so (and maybe even note that they have NOT reported the offending post to the admins). Folks that see the offending post before it gets edited would see the reply and my hope is that will serve to diffuse their reaction until the post does get edited. Once it is edited, basically, there will be nothing for anyone to see so to speak - either in the original post or the reply. In the rare cases where there's a real problem, say a flamewar erupts, we continue with these efforts but also take it to the admins thru the existing reporting process, but by us all doing so, we provide clear notice of a serious problem that needs their rapid attention.

Someone play devil's advocate for me. How could we have problems with this approach?

I have nothing against passion. In these forums, that passion needs to follow the forum rules. So, with that segue, let's have a look at the rules in terms of policing ourselves:



OK...the first paragraph is pretty clear cut. With WCG being based in the US, this is probably as much due to the legal environment as anything. I took the bulleted list and numbered it here for ease of reference. I would say that 1,2,3,4,10,12 and 13 are "vague" in the sense that they will likely involve some degree of interpretation. What's "enjoyable", "kid friendly" or "rude"? One person's honesty is another's rudeness. I would say the rest are most likely to be pretty clear cut. What's profanity is most likely going to be straight forward although if you do it in something other than English, I myself probably wouldn't catch it. As nice as it would be, there are no absolutes. There's some degree of interpretation to all of the rules, some more so that others. I think we have to look at a situation in terms of "reasonableness" - how would a reasonable person view it? If we find a post objectionable and the poster disagrees with us, then we're in the same boat we are now. The WCG admins have the final say one way or another and they'd have to make that call. It's 6,7,8 and 10 I believe where we have had problems and where threads have become problems. As for determining what is "rude", let's err on the side of caution. Folks should be able to disagree and agree to disagree. It's when we react to a post with a lack of consideration, with disrespect that things tend to get warm. A friendly virtual tap on the shoulder and a "are you sure you meant it that way?" will diffuse a situation before it gets out of hand - at least that's my hope and I want to believe that is a reasonable one with our community. It seems that usually it's the unintended rudeness that degenerates into flame wars. We seem to average one strong "dust up" each month. That's not an out of control situation but it is one that many of us tire of. Compost happens. We will never stop it all but we're tired of being tired of it.

So, if you are, then join with me and commit yourself to help with #1 "Please help to make the Forums an enjoyable experience for all members". I don't think this will be difficult. We shouldn't have to do anything to qualify us for the Nobel Peace Prize

Remind us in a little while. We're busy with other things right now. :-D

Adywebb,

As to the Forum rules, anyone can interpret it his/her way. To me # 1 rule is respect and decency.... the rest comes naturally if that rule is followed. I cant care less about any short or long fuse excuse a member has in that department. That's the rule we should not waiver from....not in full words or in acronyms. Than, no tools are required at all and operation of the red little face right hand bottom of every post would be enough for the rare straying.

cheers

I like word games

Respect
–noun
1. a particular, detail, or point (usually prec. by in): to differ in some respect.
2. relation or reference: inquiries with respect to a route.
3. esteem for or a sense of the worth or excellence of a person, a personal quality or ability, or something considered as a manifestation of a personal quality or ability: I have great respect for her judgment.
4. deference to a right, privilege, privileged position, or someone or something considered to have certain rights or privileges; proper acceptance or courtesy; acknowledgment: respect for a suspect's right to counsel; to show respect for the flag; respect for the elderly.
5. the condition of being esteemed or honored: to be held in respect.
6. respects, a formal expression or gesture of greeting, esteem, or friendship: Give my respects to your parents.
7. favor or partiality.
8. Archaic. a consideration.
–verb (used with object) 9. to hold in esteem or honor: I cannot respect a cheat.
10. to show regard or consideration for: to respect someone's rights.
11. to refrain from intruding upon or interfering with: to respect a person's privacy.
12. to relate or have reference to.
—Idioms13. in respect of, in reference to; in regard to; concerning.
14. in respect that, Archaic. because of; since.
15. pay one's respects, a. to visit in order to welcome, greet, etc.: We paid our respects to the new neighbors.
b. to express one's sympathy, esp. to survivors following a death: We paid our respects to the family.

16. with respect to, referring to; concerning: with respect to your latest request.
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Decency

noun, plural -cies. 1. the state or quality of being decent.
2. conformity to the recognized standard of propriety, good taste, modesty, etc.
3. decencies, a. the recognized standards of decent or proper behavior; proprieties: The least you can expect from them is some respect for the decencies.
b. the requirements or amenities for decent or comfortable living: to be able to afford the decencies.



They`re both very vague and would have different attributes depending how you live, where you`re from, type of person you are etc.,



This statement shows no decency or respect for anyone who differs from that viewpoint.

One could go on endlessly about interpretations of the rules but it won`t stop anything happening I assure you. People argue, people get frustrated, people deliberately wind each other up. It`s life.