| Index | Recent Threads | Unanswered Threads | Who's Active | Guidelines | Search |
| World Community Grid Forums
|
| No member browsing this thread |
|
Thread Status: Active Total posts in this thread: 246
|
|
| Author |
|
|
Former Member
Cruncher Joined: May 22, 2018 Post Count: 0 Status: Offline |
Third installment
closing in Your table is so elegant. I think I had a key once that could write that vertical slash. I forgot where to find it. The sea-lake words are interesting. You have created an Ijsselmeer in the Zuiderzee, right? Or wrong In Denmark we operate in the principle with ’hav’ for sea/ocean and ’sø’ for an inland lake. ’Sø’ is very much like ’zee’, ’See’ and ’sea’ but as the Germans we don’t seem to have things straight. And you don't either, if the Ijsselmeer example is right. ’Hav’ has a different origin - a Norrøn (Nordic) one. We have the word ’Nordsøen’ (which is a direct translation from 'The North Sea' when we talk about the ocean between Norway, Denmark, Germany, the Netherlands, Belgium, France and England) using the ’lake’ word. However, if we talk about the coastal waters along the Juland peninsula, it is called ’Vesterhavet’ (The West Sea), and ’hav’ is normally the bigger thing and lake the smaller. It’s easier with The Baltic Sea, which is invariably called ’Østersøen’ (The East Sea). So what do you call the North Sea in Dutch? And would you have another name for your Dutch coastal waters? |
||
|
|
adriverhoef
Master Cruncher The Netherlands Joined: Apr 3, 2009 Post Count: 2346 Status: Offline Project Badges:
|
Shall I first reply to this:
2nd installment Yes, let's do that. To clarify some things.its funny that I cannot learn your name. [...] BUT how does the 'hoef' part fit in? [...] I mauled the 'hoef' part in the Google Wordgrinder and got this: hoev -> Danish = 'hov' which means hoof in English and is a part of an Ezel - it may also mean 'oops!' hoev -> English should be 'need' which fits with the suggestion in hoev -> German 'Bedürfnis' - 'behoefte' means 'need', indeed. (Also, the Dutch verb 'hoeven' means 'to need'. But let's not get into that.) - 'hoef' is also a donkey's hoof and also belongs to other 'hoefdieren' (ungulates) (Danish: hovdyr; German: Huftier). But that's not it. I believe 'hoef' in this case comes from 'hoef' or 'hoeve' (English: farm(house), German: (Bauern)hof). The pronunciation of the Dutch 'hoef' is the same as Huf in German and hoof in English. There is a Dutch TV-meteorologist (German: Wettermoderator), a weatherman, and he is called Marco Verhoef with surname Verhoef, obviously. But maybe you know Dutch filmdirector Paul Verhoeven. He is best known for directing the films RoboCop (1987), Total Recall (1990), Basic Instinct (1992), Showgirls (1995), Starship Troopers (1997), and Elle (2016). The Dutch plural of 'hoef' is 'hoeven'. :-) Don't you think KliK will appriciate that we moved this developing story so he shall not have it between his spreadsheets? And probably others, too. ![]() |
||
|
|
Former Member
Cruncher Joined: May 22, 2018 Post Count: 0 Status: Offline |
keithhenry, I apologize for being "dumsmart" - a novel word invented and used by our Queen in her traditional New Year speech many years ago, to reproach the Danes for their in her opinion less than pleasant behavior toward strangers - it can be translated into "stupid-smart" and we never forget. We are embarassed and hurt at the same time. The word harbors some arrogance, a good deal of plain stupidity and a pound of inconsideration in it.
I have done my homework on Wikipedia now. No throbbing Diesels, but an unusual man who lead a life with many faces. A Bohemian one mixed with main stream traits. I intend to sample his writings. Plenty is available at Danish libraries. Here is Icelandic singer and composer Björk, ... e e cumming's poems. I think Mr e e cummings would have approved. |
||
|
|
adriverhoef
Master Cruncher The Netherlands Joined: Apr 3, 2009 Post Count: 2346 Status: Offline Project Badges:
|
The sea-lake words are interesting. You have created an Ijsselmeer in the Zuiderzee, right? Or wrong Well, there is a North Sea and we (the people from the Netherlands) had a "South Sea": Zuiderzee. When the 32 km long dike Afsluitdijk was finally constructed in 1932, the Zuiderzee ceased to exist and was renamed IJsselmeer (with two capitals at the beginning), turning the salt water inlet of the North Sea into a fresh water lake. (The IJ is a digraph of the letters i and j in the Dutch language, it behaves like a single letter in Dutch orthography - this explains why both letters appear capitalized: 'IJsland' is the Dutch word for Iceland.) The river IJssel is an offspring of the river Rhine, lending its name to the Lake IJssel and to the province of Overijssel. So what do you call the North Sea in Dutch? Noordzee.And would you have another name for your Dutch coastal waters? The area between the Dutch north coast of the mainland and the Frisian Islands ("Waddeneilanden") is called Waddenzee (the Wadden Sea).We also have 'mudflat hiking': "Mudflat hikers are people who, with the aid of a tide table, use a period of low water to walk and wade on the watershed of the mudflats, especially from the Frisian mainland coast to the Frisian islands. The Wadden Sea, a belt of the North Sea, is well suited to this traditional practice." Should I mention the province of Zeeland? Is it sea ('zee') or is it land? Both. Namesake: New Zealand was named after Zeeland. |
||
|
|
Former Member
Cruncher Joined: May 22, 2018 Post Count: 0 Status: Offline |
Fourth installment
Oh, boy, this is ballooning isn’t it? Say, little mermaid, in Dutch your last name 'mermaid' would translate as "meermin" or "zeemeermin". As to mermaids: I really like you Dutchmen being able to cover all possibilities: meermin must be a salt water mermaid, whereas the zeemeermin probably can do both salt and fresh water, which is a great feature for mermaids wanting to visit the Netherlands where the water is transformed all the time … now: what do we call a brackish-water-mermaid?The ’min’ part? It comes up as ”minus” in Danish; will that mean in the terms of a mermaid? A girl? ’min of meer’ is practically Danish – however for some reason we switch the two into ’mere eller mindre’. I never gave it a thought that they are antonyms, but you’re right, of course. In my mind I always saw it as a starting point having undefined upper and lower limits/tolerances/wiggle room. And of course I had to check the German way to say this: mehr oder weniger. - to be continued - I have your tourism part of this chapter left |
||
|
|
adriverhoef
Master Cruncher The Netherlands Joined: Apr 3, 2009 Post Count: 2346 Status: Offline Project Badges:
|
Ezelsbruggetje Almost, 'cause we use -je for diminutives. Loverly! Is the "tje" the equivalent of the diminutive "-chen" in German? It's just that some words need a 'p' or a 't':brug → brugje or bruggetje bus → busje hemd → hempje lam → lammetje lamp → lampje land → landje slot → slotje water → watertje And ezel! Did you use ezel in The Netherlands (and should I write The Netherlands with a capitol "T"?) to do farm work? According to my dictionary you should write "the Netherlands"and the farmers used horses to do farm work (Dutch website). |
||
|
|
keithhenry
Ace Cruncher Senile old farts of the world ....uh.....uh..... nevermind Joined: Nov 18, 2004 Post Count: 18667 Status: Offline Project Badges:
|
keithhenry, I apologize for being "dumsmart" - a novel word invented and used by our Queen in her traditional New Year speech many years ago, to reproach the Danes for their in her opinion less than pleasant behavior toward strangers - it can be translated into "stupid-smart" and we never forget. We are embarassed and hurt at the same time. The word harbors some arrogance, a good deal of plain stupidity and a pound of inconsideration in it. I have done my homework on Wikipedia now. No throbbing Diesels, but an unusual man who lead a life with many faces. A Bohemian one mixed with main stream traits. I intend to sample his writings. Plenty is available at Danish libraries. Here is Icelandic singer and composer Björk,... e e cumming's poems. I think Mr e e cummings would have approved. My dear, if you feel compelled to apologize then I must unquestioningly and unhesitatingly forgive you - for being human. I learned long ago to be ever mindful of the three fingers I point at myself anytime I choose to point one at someone else - though as I continue on my journey into senile old fart-dom, I will inevitably forget that at times as well. I am doomed it seems to fail miserably at growing old gracefully. So, as you can see, I am not a good influence and have somehow managed to unfortunately affect you by some means beyond my feeble comprehension. Actually, to be honest, there is a VERY logical reason for your initial understanding. There is an American company - Cummins Engines - that makes, among other things, diesel engines that one American car maker has been known to heavily promote in some of its vehicles. So, the fault is not yours but lies with that dastardly villainous missing letter G. Let us immediately string it up from the highest rafters in the nearest outhouse (after all, we hang plastic pine trees from our car mirrors).Einstein was quite right - God does not play dice with the universe. He also has a wicked sense of humor that I am reminded of each and every time I look at myself in the mirror. |
||
|
|
adriverhoef
Master Cruncher The Netherlands Joined: Apr 3, 2009 Post Count: 2346 Status: Offline Project Badges:
|
You wondered about the origins of the word 'meermin', little mermaid. The weird thing is that the male variant of the 'zeemeermin' is called 'zeemeerman' (in fact 'min' doesn't mean "girl"). I'm referring to http://www.etymologiebank.nl/trefwoord/meermin. The second part 'min' is derived from 'man' (human male), originally meaning 'mens' (human), which could of course also be a human female. The 'man' part was changed to 'min' because of the Dutch verb 'minnen' (to love). 'Meerminnen' were to ruin men who fell in love with them.
|
||
|
|
Former Member
Cruncher Joined: May 22, 2018 Post Count: 0 Status: Offline |
Fifth installment
- turning me into a tourist, which it my favorite state; you should know I went on a road trip by myself to the Netherlands for eight days in April, and I think I saw a lot and know for sure there is much, much more left to see Vaalserberg adriverhoef, your highest mountain is about twice as high as Denmark’s tallest at 172,54 m – deduct the bronze age barrow on the top, and we’re down to 170,77 m. Our most popular ”mountain” is only 147 m, but it makes up for it by a spectacular name: ”The Sky Mountain”. I have put Vaalserberg on my ”Holland” list (maybe I should rename the list ”Nederlandene”). The hike and the view are attractive. Frisian Islands Pearls on a string. I noticed the word ”Frysland” and it gave me the chills – ’fryse’ meaning to be cold in Danish. Have you been there? Nordzee Something we share and battle against – you more than we. The tide must be more powerful along your coastline and have to be taken into consideration all the time when construction your seawalls. Deltawerken One huge feat! You have sunk oceans of money into that. Do you regard that seawall as finished? Or will you have to expand in some ways in order to take a possible rise of the water level in the oceans into account? Sand Engine Now that I didn’t know about. That is really something! That goes right to the "Nederlandene" list. It even says it works. I wonder if the coastal protection people in Denmark have studied this? ![]() Hondsbossche Zeewering is similar to our Danish dykes, but much larger in height and looks sturdier. Say, do you feel safe from the flooding catastophes that have hit the Netherlands historically? I remember in 1953 when I was in second class in school that we collected especially clothing to be shipped to the Netherlands. Ijsselmeer en Afsluitsdijk Crossed it in 1973? Never forgot. Did it again i April this year. Again: What a feat! Waterland Yes, water, water, water everywhere. I even stopped at a very neat waterworks – that was because of the attractive building, though! Thank you for taking me on a tour of your country which I remember with great fondness. Oh, water! I spent 2x2 nights on houseboats on the Spaarne in Haarlem and on the Rhine in Arnhem …End of first chapter. It has been such a pleasure. I thought nobody was interested in language this way until I noticed your little ”hints” to KliK Good night. I hope to catch up with some of the new chapters tomorrow ….. |
||
|
|
Former Member
Cruncher Joined: May 22, 2018 Post Count: 0 Status: Offline |
keithhenry, Cummins without the "G" certainly is different from the e e cummings ....
|
||
|
|
|