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JacobKlein
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Re: It's as bad as the beta


BUT is there a problem? App is doing what it was designed to do, use the GPU to it's maximum.

Yes, there is a problem. I have BOINC setup to use my CPUs even though I am at the computer also using them, and there is no interference with my usage. I also have BOINC setup to use my GPUs even though I am at the computer also using them, and there is no interference with my usage while processing Poem@Home tasks or GPUGrid.net tasks. But there is a huge interference, in the form of massive display lag, while processing WCG HCC tasks, for some users, and there shouldn't be. The GPU app is supposed to share the GPU with you, when you are active, just as the CPU app shares the CPU with you, when you are active.


Perhaps, if possible, a window to set percentage of GPU use so that the user can decide what to use whether 10% or 100%..

%GPU use has nothing to do with the problem. Other project GPU tasks use upwards of 99% of the GPU, and have no problems with lag. This project uses ~98% GPU, and has major problems. Note also that it has nothing to do with CPU availability, either. I'm still convinced it has to do with priority, or frequency.

I'm available to test any possible solutions that WCG would like to try, including beta apps on a beta channel. Please fix this.

Regards,
Jacob
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by JacobKlein at Oct 14, 2012 9:16:19 PM]
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Jim1348
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Re: It's as bad as the beta

I solved the lag problem by adding a second video card, connecting it to my monitor and excluded it from use.
..........................................
It's crunching away and I'm still able to use my computer without any lag.

Several notes, though.
The only card that would work in the second PCIE slot had to be an nVidia card. It's what I have in my primary slot and Windows wouldn't load another driver other than the nVidia driver.

I'm using Windows 8 and BOINC 7.0.31.

I use two video cards too. But whether you can mix them depends on your OS. You could not mix Nvidia and AMD with Vista, but you can with Windows 7 (though you have to be careful to do a clean install and get rid of any old drivers first). It looks like Windows 8 is going back to the previous method, maybe for security or stability purposes, I don't know.
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mmstick
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Re: It's as bad as the beta

You are correct, the lag has nothing to do with GPU usage, even at a usage of 50% this app could reduce your framerates drastically, the problem is with a default setting in this app has been configured in a way it will make sure it will prevent your screen from refreshing often. There is a command you can insert into your app info to reduce the frequency and polling rates so that you can regain your refresh rates.

It seems the app has been configured to settings optimal for, say, a Radeon HD 7870s power level, so 7900 cards can get by with minimal refresh rate lag, anything below that will have major lag.
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nanoprobe
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Re: It's as bad as the beta

It seems the app has been configured to settings optimal for, say, a Radeon HD 7870s power level, so 7900 cards can get by with minimal refresh rate lag, anything below that will have major lag.

I have 5830s on 3 machines. 0 lag on any on them.
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In 1969 I took an oath to defend and protect the U S Constitution against all enemies, both foreign and Domestic. There was no expiration date.


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Movieman
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Re: It's as bad as the beta


BUT is there a problem? App is doing what it was designed to do, use the GPU to it's maximum.

Yes, there is a problem. I have BOINC setup to use my CPUs even though I am at the computer also using them, and there is no interference with my usage. I also have BOINC setup to use my GPUs even though I am at the computer also using them, and there is no interference with my usage while processing Poem@Home tasks or GPUGrid.net tasks. But there is a huge interference, in the form of massive display lag, while processing WCG HCC tasks, for some users, and there shouldn't be. The GPU app is supposed to share the GPU with you, when you are active, just as the CPU app shares the CPU with you, when you are active.


Perhaps, if possible, a window to set percentage of GPU use so that the user can decide what to use whether 10% or 100%..

%GPU use has nothing to do with the problem. Other project GPU tasks use upwards of 99% of the GPU, and have no problems with lag. This project uses ~98% GPU, and has major problems. Note also that it has nothing to do with CPU availability, either. I'm still convinced it has to do with priority, or frequency.

I'm available to test any possible solutions that WCG would like to try, including beta apps on a beta channel. Please fix this.

Regards,
Jacob

Then perhaps my observations are totally wrong and if so my apologies.
For myself I see no major issues so no need to continue in this thread.
Best of luck.
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Simplex0
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Re: It's as bad as the beta

It seems the app has been configured to settings optimal for, say, a Radeon HD 7870s power level, so 7900 cards can get by with minimal refresh rate lag, anything below that will have major lag.

I have 5830s on 3 machines. 0 lag on any on them.


Same here. I have 2 x 5870 on 1 machine and 1 x 6970 on an other machine with no lag at all.
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[Edit 3 times, last edit by Simplex0 at Oct 15, 2012 8:55:38 AM]
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Jim1348
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Re: It's as bad as the beta

%GPU use has nothing to do with the problem. Other project GPU tasks use upwards of 99% of the GPU, and have no problems with lag. This project uses ~98% GPU, and has major problems. Note also that it has nothing to do with CPU availability, either. I'm still convinced it has to do with priority, or frequency.
I think it does have something to do with the problem, but it may not be a direct correlation. From what I hear on the Folding forum, the %GPU gives an indication of use of some resource on the chip (not sure what), but what other resources are actually being used depends on the application. For example, games and videos will use different parts of the chip than distributed computing applications. And even the DC applications will vary, depending on fixed point, floating point and a lot of other factors. So what is 99% on one application may be different than what is 99% on another.

And comparing CPU and GPU percentages is really comparing apples and oranges, since the CPU can be preempted for other tasks much more easily than a GPU can. If you can change the priorities and get an improvement, that is great, but I would not be too surprised if the HCC developers have already done what they can in that regard.

I think at the user end, our real level of control is to choose either Nvidia or AMD for a given project, and ideally use two cards, one for display and one for computing. It is clear to me that AMD is better for this project, and you probably won't be changing that advantage whatever you do. (For Folding, I would give the opposite advice.)
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David Autumns
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Re: It's as bad as the beta

OK I've sussed it

When I am out or asleep I suspend GPUGrid and my PC happily stutters away while I can't see it

Then when I'm in using my PC, in the bit where the GPU isn't running at the end of each WU, I can position my cursor to resume GPUGrid and can watch Media Player, read my email, post on the WCG and the science still gets done.

That my compromise

One I shouldn't have had to make. Me and many like me.

Is there an ETA for the fix?


Dave
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Simplex0
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Re: It's as bad as the beta

OK I've sussed it

When I am out or asleep I suspend GPUGrid and my PC happily stutters away while I can't see it

Then when I'm in using my PC, in the bit where the GPU isn't running at the end of each WU, I can position my cursor to resume GPUGrid and can watch Media Player, read my email, post on the WCG and the science still gets done.

That my compromise

One I shouldn't have had to make. Me and many like me.

Is there an ETA for the fix?


Dave


Just wondering. Can this be an Open-cl support problem with the Nvidia cards? I think Nvidia is known to have a really bad Open-cl support compared with ATI\AMD card?
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Bearcat
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Re: It's as bad as the beta

Am starting to wonder if the lag is dependant on type of monitor and how its hooked up to the pc. My 5670 has a 21 inch monitor attached by VGA with little lag. My 6950 has a 24 inch dell using display port with allot of lag. When I get time, will change to HDMI to see if anything changes. For those having lag, how is your monitor attached?
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