I wonder how many people are dropping out and aren't even bothering to post here? It would be interesting to see those statistics as this "migration" proceeds.

One last post, and then I'm gone.

Didactylos wrote:

> For the record, Zone Alarm breaks the Windows Style rules with their flashing icon. It is annoying, and Microsoft specifically warn against it.

You don't give a reference for this assertion, but it's kind of odd given that MS Windows networking icon (the two screen thingy) in the XP notification area is animated in much the same way that the ZA icon is (and suffers from BOINC interference similarly). The corresponding Vista icon can also be optionally animated.

But anyway, that's a small point. I'm rather more concerned by the seeming arrogance of the answers I've received. It's all my fault, it's all ZoneAlarm's fault, it never seems to be BOINC's fault. You state this as fact, but it's only your interpretation. My interpretation is different; everything else in my setup works OK except BOINC, so from where I stand it's BOINC that's the problem.

You don't seem to understand. I'm no saint: I have this very weak altruistic streak that will persuade me to donate my spare CPU cycles to something I hope is worthwhile, but the moment it gets hard in any way I will stop. I get nothing tangible out of this, just a vague warm feeling when I think about it, which isn't very often. It's highly unlikely that anything I do will contribute to any cure for me or for anyone I care about in my lifetime.

retsof says:

> first time posters, only with problems.

This is a support forum. What else do you expect? I'm not interested in participating in the forums or the "community" generally, nor in participating in some "team". I'll post only when I need to, and that's my choice.

I'm very concerned that you seem now to be restricting grid computing to a community comprising just IT professionals, because only they will have the knowhow to set it up. The BOINC system is complex, quite unnecessarily so in my view. The available documentation is pathetically inadequate. I'm an old IT pro (now retired). For example, when the BOINC installer out of the blue asks me "Install as a service?" at least I know what it means, but the average user isn't going to. Even so, with no other help available even I have no idea what all the implications of running it as service are.

There must be millions of folks out there who use PCs just to do email, type the odd letter, visit a few websites, sort pictures of their grandchildren into folders. Their CPUs probably run 98% idle all the time. Aren't these the kind of people that grid computing should be trying to recruit? Maybe they don't have power machines to contribute like you guys, but at least they're not using them for power hungry video games or processing all the time.

These folks will not come looking for answers on your forums, and they will certainly not post. Even if they could figure out how your clunky forums software works, they would be put off after the first few clicks by all the technobabble in here. If there are any problems they will just give up and go quietly away. To get them involved you need software that installs effortlessly without asking any silly questions, and once running needs no maintenance and has zero side effects in its default configuration in any common setup. That's your responsibility to achieve, not theirs.

A while ago I demo'd the UD agent to such a group, because having run it without problem for a few years I was prepared to recommend it. I don't know how many of them took it up, but I'm now going to have to go back to them and say that, with the demise of UD, I cannot recommend the BOINC agent in its place.

I will stay a member of WCG for the time being, but I'm going to be one of the many not using the BOINC agent that another thread has been discussing for a while. I don't promise to look in here very often, if at all. But if and when you get all these issues fixed, if somebody cares to drop me an email, then I might be willing to take another look.

My network icon flashes when there is some activity. Go figure.

Where did we leave off?


The supporters get frustrated when the one-time posters with a problem have already made the jump to hyperspace.


When we see a predetermined post like this, there's not a whole lot that anyone can do to solve your problem. We would probably ask that you post some pieces-parts of different file contents over several messages.

For me, BOINC was a drop-in, attach to the project and walk-away. Yes, there could be some tuning for optimum results, if one wanted to do it. New and improved BOINCs with better messages come along frequently.

Any others still returning results here should get an e-mail about the conversion timetable.

With UD there was a cryptic one liner now and then and there was no message log. Either it worked or it didn't, rather much like ADSL from the phone company. It is being phased out here because WCG has a very old version, and UD got bought out anyway. United Devices is no longer its own entity. How did you like that "we-wrote-it-so-we'll-kill-it-and-pull-the-plug-so-everything-goes-into-a-black-hole" result at grid.org? We've kept the UD program alive for some useful science and we've known about the UD to BOINC transition here for more than a year. One could always step up to BOINC sooner rather than later. On May 31, the last UD workunits will be sent out.

That's true, but there are other programs out there that also require some thought and contribution. I have personally heard of several users with dead, unusable computers saying, "A virus, what's that?" "Overfragmented disk, what's that". "out of disk space, what's that?" BOINC was not involved.

I checked the official messages section and perused the web site but I didn't see a copy of the email that's going out to people still using UD.

If it's already been posted, could someone provide a link? If not, could we put a copy in member news?

From the complaints I've seen here, I would guess that the email doesn't give people a lot of guidance. I know that in theory that shouldn't be necessary, but that doesn't alway seem to be the case.

Another idea is seeing how many people here would be willing to give one-on-one advice. I think people would give boinc more of a shot if they knew they could "converse" with someone directly rather than having to face the harsh glare of the forum. To the people who post here regularly I'm sure that doesn't seem like a big deal, but it scares the fudge out of a lot of people. Potential liability might nix that idea, but advice is given in the forums all of the time, so this shouldn't be that much different. Just a thought.

Kevin, I've posted this mail to the forum the day I received it in the " Why so few convert to WCG...." thread, so it was up for a wee while. (oh oh here's trouble)

You wrote in the back room that 4500 converted within 24 hours. Considering the absent avalanche of B&S, smells like a rather smooth experience. If there is a few % fall-out, there is still substantial gain particular from the multi core devices, mostly because it frees up you guys to do less duplication of science testing and porting work. Wonder if you have a number say in points of how much these first 4500 convertees did yesterday versus what they did in RAC before the migration. That will give an idea of the success rate. AND with the pathfinders having posted their initial problems and discussions of resolutions and work-arounds, expect in fact from those that just read the fora to have an even higher success rate.

cheers