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Former Member
Cruncher Joined: May 22, 2018 Post Count: 0 Status: Offline |
Has anyone considered all the power that is used by Boinc computing. I put a wattage meter on my two pc's and found that when doing nothing, just setting there they consumed 23w. But when are both crunching WCG Bonic work units they are consuming 650 watts.
So in the course of year that's 627 watts * 24 hour *365 days = 5492.52 Kilowatts hours in a year. That's a lot of power and produces a huge chunk of green gases especially if live like I do where electricity is produced by burning coal. It's also a cost of $617 in electricity at local rates. Lucky for me I'm in a condo where I effectively dump the cost on my neighbours. I wonder if anyone who is running this clients realizes just how much money they are spending and how much enviromental damage they are doing in the process. The myth that computers are just sitting is just that a myth, newer PC's are actually very energy efficient when they are not data cruncing. |
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Former Member
Cruncher Joined: May 22, 2018 Post Count: 0 Status: Offline |
This is a topic we discuss frequently. You might find referring to previous discussions informative.
I rather suspect your "doing nothing" wattage is understated. A fair comparison is "under normal load". If you let your computer power down or go into a sleep mode (even if it's not full sleep mode) then the power used will be reduced. Also, your "full load" seems unusually high. Does that include any peripherals? Monitor? Is that the total for both computers? |
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RKN_frost
Advanced Cruncher Joined: May 28, 2005 Post Count: 73 Status: Offline |
You can also save energy and money by:
----------------------------------------- only taking cold showers - using candles instead of electric light - not using air conditioners - only eating cold meals - walking or using public transportation instead of driving your own car - turning off standby on tv, stereo etc. ... There are quite a lot of probabilities to save energy - personally, I think that energy should at first saved where it is spend in the most useless way. I don't put on the light, if it's not dark, I have energy-saving electric bulbs, I drive the car very seldom, turn off standby etc. What I save there (especially with the car) is much more than what I spend for keeping my (currently two) BOINC crunchers occupied (one 24/7, the other one about 12/7). The difference is, that most of these things are not really needed. BOINC IMHO serves a very usefull purpose, so this will one of the last things I'd consider to deactivate. ![]() [Edit 1 times, last edit by RKN_frost at Aug 27, 2007 10:37:40 PM] |
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retsof
Former Community Advisor USA Joined: Jul 31, 2005 Post Count: 6824 Status: Offline Project Badges:
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I'll ask about the other side of that. How much power do all of those wattmeters use? There are also many wattmeters out there measuring things besides computers.
----------------------------------------This article talks about people that went through SEVERAL wattmeters because the accuracy was so bad on many of them. I'm sure that the effects of manufacturing new wattmeters used even more resources and electricity than the wattmeters themselves. http://www.eham.net/reviews/detail/4342 more non-electricity generating greenhouse gripes. Speaking of "greenhouse gases", at least one article said this week that the most polluting coal burning these days is inside Chinese coal mines, without even including places like Indonesia and India. There is no electricity being generated from this, but plenty of coal smoke all the same. Smaller coal fires have been burning in Colorado and Pennsylvania for up to 100 years. The post office in Centralia, PA had to close after the inside temperature reached 117 degrees F. A team from the Netherlands studied the environmental effects of underground fires in China, concluding that the fires release up to 360 million metric tons of carbon dioxide each year, equal to two to three percent of global carbon dioxide releases. According to Stracher's forthcoming article in the "International Journal of Coal Geology," scientists have determined that coal fires in China consume up to 200 million tons of coal per year. For comparison, coal consumption in the United States during 2000 was just over one billion tons, according to the U.S. Department of Energy. (Coal burned in the U.S. is scrubbed, with sulfur and some gases being reclaimed.) What about slash-and-burn agriculture? Indonesia is a very bad offender, and smoke from Mexico and Central America was especially heavy in Texas a few years ago. Burning trees doesn't make electricity either. Trash is burned in Japan due to lack of landfill space. Where does all of that smoke go? And then, there's the burping cow problem. San Franciso, California is failing clean air standards due to pollution coming over from China.
SUPPORT ADVISOR
Work+GPU i7 8700 12threads School i7 4770 8threads Default+GPU Ryzen 7 3700X 16threads Ryzen 7 3800X 16 threads Ryzen 9 3900X 24threads Home i7 3540M 4threads50% |
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retsof
Former Community Advisor USA Joined: Jul 31, 2005 Post Count: 6824 Status: Offline Project Badges:
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You can also save energy and money by: - only taking cold showers There is still a lot of energy saving room here. Why take more than one shower per month? Whether you need one or not, take one when you hitch up the horses to go into town for supplies the next day. Take a cold "navy shower". Get wet and then TURN OFF THE WATER. Lather up. Turn the water back on and rinse off. Then turn off the water. Somebody had to pump all of that water you are using to the top of a nearby hill so it could run down into your house (or cave). The guy at the stables probably has showers available for all of the horse drivers, anyway. There's no need to pipe all of that water out to your house (or cave). You can even stand next to the horse when it is washed down. Feel free to borrow the currycomb. Shivering for awhile will even save wear-and-tear on the towels. You'd just have to wash them. You can use a tub and washboard to do that, and hang the towels outside to dry.
SUPPORT ADVISOR
----------------------------------------Work+GPU i7 8700 12threads School i7 4770 8threads Default+GPU Ryzen 7 3700X 16threads Ryzen 7 3800X 16 threads Ryzen 9 3900X 24threads Home i7 3540M 4threads50% [Edit 3 times, last edit by retsof at Aug 27, 2007 11:04:28 PM] |
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retsof
Former Community Advisor USA Joined: Jul 31, 2005 Post Count: 6824 Status: Offline Project Badges:
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The heat generated by a PERSON is about 80 watts by one estimate and 400 BTU by another. Justify yourself.
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SUPPORT ADVISOR
Work+GPU i7 8700 12threads School i7 4770 8threads Default+GPU Ryzen 7 3700X 16threads Ryzen 7 3800X 16 threads Ryzen 9 3900X 24threads Home i7 3540M 4threads50% |
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twilyth
Master Cruncher US Joined: Mar 30, 2007 Post Count: 2130 Status: Offline Project Badges:
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I think questioning energy use is a good thing to do as long as you question ALL of your energy use. I apologize for the flippant and sarcastic comments of some members. No one thinks you should walk to work so you can run boinc.
----------------------------------------However I would also question the accuracy of your readings. My fastest machine is a dual core AMD 4200+ that is overclocked by about 10%. It runs boinc on both cores 24/7, has 2 gig of high performance D-RAM, 4 120mm fans and 4 7200rpm hard drives. It never draws more than 200 watts - in fact, I've never seen it top 180. I don't doubt that some machines, such as a quad core could top 300 watts, but I seriously doubt that either machine only draws 25 watts when operating system is running (as opposed to being in suspend or hibernate mode). It's probably a good idea to check the meter on something that you already know the wattage on. Try one check on the low end - say a light bulb and try another check on the high end - like window a/c, big screen tv, dehumidifier, or even a vacuum cleaner. Each of these should have the voltage and amperage - and probably even the wattage - right on the housing somewhere (by the way, you probably know this but watts = voltage x amperage). A portable space heater is also a good guage - these usually draw at least 1300 watts and should top out at about 1500. If you see that the meter is more than say 10 or 20% off the stated wattage, you should probably get another brand of wattage meter. Probably the best known is the "Kill-a-watt" meter. Once you have an accurate reading of true difference between your computer running boinc and not, I think you'll see that it's not a huge difference. Also, there's not law that says you should run your computer 24/7. If you often leave your machine on at night so that it can finish some task, there are utilities that will shut it down for based on certain parameters that you set. I use AMP WinOFF. It's a free utility and seems to work pretty well - although I have only recently started using it do a daily reboot on machines that I don't look at very often (see the help file for how to do this or email me). We can all do more to save energy, but unfortunately, in most cases saving money means spending it first - on compact fluorescents, new appliances, etc. Running boinc does cost money and energy, but the amount over and above what would normally be used shouldn't be any where near as broad as you indicated in your post. And the potential benefits from whatever that incremental usage is will probably be of great benefit to all mankind. ![]() ![]() |
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Bearcat
Master Cruncher USA Joined: Jan 6, 2007 Post Count: 2803 Status: Offline Project Badges:
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Just imagine how long it would take to do this crunching with a pencil and paper. It would never get done (at least not in our time). The benefit outweighs the energy consumption. You can conserve in other parts of your home to balance out usage.
----------------------------------------Randy
Crunching for humanity since 2007!
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JmBoullier
Former Community Advisor Normandy - France Joined: Jan 26, 2007 Post Count: 3716 Status: Offline Project Badges:
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Lucky for me I'm in a condo where I effectively dump the cost on my neighbours. I see this as a much bigger concern than what our machines may use to compute WUs. This way of aggregating expenses is definitely impeding energy or water saving efforts because -- people don't know exactly (or sometimes even approximately) how much they use -- people may say like you "it's not a problem for me, it's shared between all of us" -- people who are ready to make some effort are really not rewarded for their effort -- eventually what is lost abnormally "somewhere" outside the apartments or the common space is either completely unknown or very difficult to measure (particularly true for water leakage under the ground). When it comes to heating the waste is even more obvious and too often impossible to avoid. When the installation is so bad (or so complex) that some flats have to be overheated for having the most difficult to heat "just livable" you can see open windows in all those overheated flats while it's freezing outside! A real waste but people living there have no other choice. |
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Vester
Senior Cruncher USA Joined: Nov 18, 2004 Post Count: 325 Status: Offline Project Badges:
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Somebody left their hat.
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