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Sgt.Joe
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USA
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Re: 24 Hour Deadline too Short

Well, I think if the 24 hour deadline is too short for some of your machines, just don't run this project on those machines. I am only running this project on one machine(Linux) and am only seeing about 1 resend per 20 jobs. It could be different for Windows. Sometimes our hardware is just too limiting to do adequate justice to what we desire to crunch.
Cheers
That is a reasonable suggestion Sgt.Joe, however I have 2 things that work against doing that:

1. Limited number of profiles available, I am already using special profiles for Android and HSTB. There are none left to make a special profile to accommodate this problem. Adding additional profiles must be the oldest item on the Cruncher Wish List.
2. Without the contribution of the slower computers I cannot reach the next level, thus eliminating my incentive to continue to participate in FAHB vs. one of the other projects.

Cheers coffee
[Edit to fix typo]

If my memory serves me correctly, there was a method posted in the forum probably about 10 years ago or more concerning the issue of more profiles. Someone posted a how to list of adding additional profiles, totally unsanctioned by WCG.If I get the chance I may go searching for it and see if it is still possible.
Found it here
Cheers
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Sgt. Joe
*Minnesota Crunchers*
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[Edit 2 times, last edit by Sgt.Joe at Jan 21, 2018 3:01:50 AM]
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adriverhoef
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Re: 24 Hour Deadline too Short

With only one tweak(*) after changing every occurrence of the 'old' profile's name into something new, it works indeed! Thank you so much, Sgt. Joe. rose

  • You have to insert the string https://www.worldcommunitygrid.org in front of the first '/' in the string action="/ms/device/processBoincProfileConfigSA.do" before you finally save the locally saved HTML-file.
  • [Jan 21, 2018 10:37:12 AM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
    NixChix
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    Re: 24 Hour Deadline too Short

    I knew about that and had created a special profile for my sister's computer years ago, but it didn't show up in the pull-down list since it is static rather than dynamic. I did not feel comfortable hacking a local copy of the web page. I felt like I was doing something prohibited.

    Has WCG said that they don't mind us doing that?

    Cheers coffee
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    [Edit 1 times, last edit by NixChix at Jan 21, 2018 7:07:33 PM]
    [Jan 21, 2018 7:06:43 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
    Sgt.Joe
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    Re: 24 Hour Deadline too Short

    I don't think they minded members doing this, but there is the caution listed as "do at your own risk." At least, I have never seen a prohibition against doing it.
    Cheers
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    Sgt. Joe
    *Minnesota Crunchers*
    [Jan 22, 2018 12:56:12 AM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
    Brummig
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    Re: 24 Hour Deadline too Short

    I found this thread because I'm having the same problem as the OP. Sometimes this is simply because there are other WCG tasks (perhaps even other FAH2 tasks) running at the time of the download, so the newly downloaded FAH2 task has a delayed start that makes it impossible to return by the deadline. Sometimes it's because the FAH2 task is simply too long, even on a fast machine. The net result is that FAH2 requires a lot of hand-holding (I'm not wasting CPU cycles on a task that I can clearly see wont complete by the deadline), disrupts other WCG tasks (because they are pushed too far down the priority list to complete in time), and makes inefficient use of server bandwidth (because of all the resends).

    The deadline is not a target, any more than a speed limit is a target. Even if the deadline was set to six years, my PCs would still return many results within a few hours, with some taking a little longer. Surely better that than resending over and over until days later someone completes by the latest deadline. And better that tasks take a little longer to complete than having people give up on FAH2 (I've already turned it off once, and I'm considering doing so again). IMHO, FAH2 is an example of "more haste, less speed".

    Return time is a BOINC metric. Why not use that to determine if it is wise to send a task to a host? And then just accept that sometimes a task will get delayed by a few hours even on a fast host.
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    [Edit 1 times, last edit by Brummig at Jan 31, 2018 2:58:17 PM]
    [Jan 31, 2018 1:47:31 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
    Former Member
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    Re: 24 Hour Deadline too Short

    I agree with a the "24 hour deadline is insane" posters - and suggesting that if a volunteer's computer can't finish a task in 24 hours to not run FAH is almost guaranteed to make a few of your members depart the whole of WCG in disgust!

    One of my computers has potential problems trying to complete the task in 24 hours (initial estimate is 18 hours runtime...) and wouldn't if delayed. (like by the end of another FAH task already running, or by another project's task in "high priority"...)

    Also, if you get a batch of WCG tasks at once, and put a good portion of them on "suspend", you have to go back and un-suspend the FAH tasks...

    I'd suggest (with others in this thread...) a 48 hour deadline... that shouldn't hang the research by that much!
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    [Edit 2 times, last edit by Former Member at Feb 5, 2018 6:00:04 PM]
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    Former Member
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    Re: 24 Hour Deadline too Short

    I don't know. I imagine the scientists who are running the project have considered the implications of the 24 hour deadline and have good reason for it. I think you opt into a project under the terms offered or pass. Although it is rarely necessary for me, I have found that you only need to momentarily suspend projects to start others.
    [Feb 5, 2018 8:07:48 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
    AgrFan
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    Re: 24 Hour Deadline too Short

    I have no problems completing work within the 24 hour deadline. I have a mix of Core 2 Duo, AthlonIIx4, i3, i5 and i7 machines with work buffers set to the default value (.30). Three machines are 6-8 years old. I'm running a mixture of Linux and Windows clients.

    FAAH2 runs best on machines running 24/7. I'm sure there is a reason why there is 24 hour deadline.

    Will be reaching 5 years in a few weeks ...
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    [Edit 4 times, last edit by AgrFan at Feb 6, 2018 4:18:36 AM]
    [Feb 6, 2018 3:59:36 AM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
    Former Member
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    Re: 24 Hour Deadline too Short

    I've got 2 i7 boxes going right now, each one can finish one of these in a couple hours at the most. The problem isn't really with the work units themselves being too long, but rather, anyone who has a queue length (buffer) built in to accommodate system downtime will run into problems.

    With the projects being run currently, running with 24hrs worth of work on a machine at any given time does not take up much drive space at all, and allows for nearly any conceivable maintenance window or high severity issue at WCG to take place and be resolved without interruption to processing on the client end.

    A 48, or even 36 hour deadline as opposed to 24 would eliminate the issue. Heck even 30 hours ought to work.

    For the time being, I've had to reduce my queue length from a full day down to about 3/4 of a day.
    [Feb 6, 2018 4:29:43 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
    WS2
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    Re: 24 Hour Deadline too Short

    I agree with citizen 422. The 24 hour deadlines cause FAAH2 units to constantly interrupt work on other projects, potentially leading to 9 days of incessant FAAH2 work for every one (late) work unit of anything sent with a 10 day deadline. I would be surprised if the other projects stay OK with that sort of presumptuous behavior for long - seems likely to lead to an ugly race between projects to achieve highest priority. If you want higher priority than another project, you should somehow pay to interrupt their work units or even to jump the queue. It just feels strange for a greedy algorithm to take advantage of volunteered time on WCG.

    Furthermore, if you happen to be running FAAH2 on your laptop when you close it for a day-long trip, you are going to be late. Only project like that. Only project that has me checking queues to see if everything is on time.

    So I think there are several reasons to look for a different solution to the chained parts problem. 48 hour deadlines would be an improvement. A policy of not interrupting units in progress could be another.

    In the meantime, I guess I will let some sedentary machines work on FAAH2 and forbid the laptops to see it at all. Wonder if that is really what FAAH2 wanted?
    [Feb 7, 2018 3:46:49 AM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
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