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World Community Grid Forums
Category: Community
Forum: Hardware Chat Room
Thread: raspberry pi cluster setup - calling on user dataman |
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Thread Status: Active Total posts in this thread: 27
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Dataman
Ace Cruncher Joined: Nov 16, 2004 Post Count: 4865 Status: Offline Project Badges: 
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Dataman: What was your decision to go with KVM instead headless? I also use a KVM for my machines. I cannot say it was a decision as I do not run anything headless. My farm currently has 45 devices (counting the RPi's) with 356 threads and 27 GPU's. It is important to me to be able to look at any machine as something seems to be screwed up somewhere at any given point in time.    |
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gs003
Cruncher NL Joined: Aug 11, 2021 Post Count: 11 Status: Offline Project Badges: 
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@dataman
I see, thank you for the insight. I misunderstood when you said you're running a cluster. I thought it was setting them up towork as one. regardless I do like the idea of organising them... I have four on the table and it's already a mess, and that rack @acibant shared is looking very attractive. @bobbyb yes, good points. My thought was that a cluster (working as one) can crunch faster than a single rpi can. one of the functions of Kubernetes, from what little I understand, is that it can manage the workload between nodes. But where it's not clear is does the boinc client then need to be programmed for clusters? my assumption is it depends on the API of the cluster... for now I have two rpi's crunching but unfortunately on holiday now and won't be able to work on this for another month. |
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BobbyB
Veteran Cruncher Canada Joined: Apr 25, 2020 Post Count: 609 Status: Offline Project Badges: 
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The Boinc clients manage themselves and since they run 100% 24/7 then no need to balance. Well they balance themselves by getting WUs as they need work. Balancing is for when you serve apps and services like Office365 or a search engine.
This whole problem came about by the misinterpretation of the term cluster. https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/cluster a-d: is physical closeness of things e: is Kubernetes. Things are programmatically "close" Do you have all the hardware Dataman mentions. Ethernet switches, cables, power strips. Headless or not. If not then KVM switches/monitor/mouse/keyboard/converters if needed. I know you don't have the cases. It would still be interesting to hear the results of this experiment. |
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Dataman
Ace Cruncher Joined: Nov 16, 2004 Post Count: 4865 Status: Offline Project Badges:
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@dataman I see, thank you for the insight. I misunderstood when you said you're running a cluster. I thought it was setting them up towork as one. regardless I do like the idea of organising them... I have four on the table and it's already a mess, and that rack @acibant shared is looking very attractive. Thanks for clarifying. I have not done a comparative cost analysis but it may be cheaper to run a 32, 64 or 138 thread processor vs. a comparable number of Pi's in a cluster. It would certainly be less messy. The problem with Pi arrays is all the "stuff" you have to attach to them and the different connectors/adapters need for different models. I built mine because, like other people, I got tired of having a bunch of them laying all around my server room. If I were to start from scratch today I would do it differently. Speaking of "stuff", I am looking for a single PSU configuration which would power 8 or, even better, 16 RPi's. I would very much like to get rid of 16 Pi PSU's and 4 power strips and replace them with a single unit. I would appreciate any links to such a config. |
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Acibant
Advanced Cruncher USA Joined: Apr 15, 2020 Post Count: 126 Status: Offline Project Badges: 
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Speaking of "stuff", I am looking for a single PSU configuration which would power 8 or, even better, 16 RPi's. I would very much like to get rid of 16 Pi PSU's and 4 power strips and replace them with a single unit. I would appreciate any links to such a config Why not use the PoE+ HAT (assuming 3B+ or 4) with a 16-port (excluding uplinks) PoE switch? |
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Dataman
Ace Cruncher Joined: Nov 16, 2004 Post Count: 4865 Status: Offline Project Badges:
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Speaking of "stuff", I am looking for a single PSU configuration which would power 8 or, even better, 16 RPi's. I would very much like to get rid of 16 Pi PSU's and 4 power strips and replace them with a single unit. I would appreciate any links to such a config Why not use the PoE+ HAT (assuming 3B+ or 4) with a 16-port (excluding uplinks) PoE switch?Thank you for the response. Yes, I looked into that but it is a rather expensive solution just to remove clutter. I was looking for something to use a standard PC PSU to a "board" with pigtails out to the individual Pi's. |
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BobbyB
Veteran Cruncher Canada Joined: Apr 25, 2020 Post Count: 609 Status: Offline Project Badges:
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I have not done a comparative cost analysis but it may be cheaper to run a 32, 64 or 138 thread processor vs. a comparable number of Pi's in a cluster. I have and it was the reason I did not go with the Pi's. To be fair, I would have had to buy everything and he already has the Pi's but will need switches etc, etcIn this thread in which you participated I gave my analysis. https://www.worldcommunitygrid.org/forums/wcg/viewpostinthread?post=658352 Each Pi = about 6000-7000+ points. This confirmed with 2 others I had posts with. I use WCG points as a measuring stick presuming points for all projects are equal. I rebuilt an old computer to use a Ryzen 3900X (24 threads). (had to buy board, CPU, memory, and fan) It gets about 180,000-200,000 points per day. Using a Pi would require 30 units. I did the math$. Not sure this works for you https://www.newegg.ca/p/0J2-007R-000W6 (price in Canadian so like 10 bucks to you  ) https://www.usbgear.com/U230PHUB5V.html [Edit 3 times, last edit by BobbyB at Aug 18, 2021 7:44:29 PM] |
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Dataman
Ace Cruncher Joined: Nov 16, 2004 Post Count: 4865 Status: Offline Project Badges:
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That might work. In fact I have a similar device in the dreaded "spare parts locker" that I once used for bitcoin miners. I will have to dig it out and see if the output is compatible for a Pi. Thanks for the idea. |
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KerSamson
Master Cruncher Switzerland Joined: Jan 29, 2007 Post Count: 1672 Status: Offline Project Badges: 
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Just few remarks:
----------------------------------------- Cluster vs conventional deployment In case of boinc, I do not see any benefits for a cluster deployment, furthermore Kubernetes will introduce an additional layer which will impact the performance negatively (not much but in some extent anyway). - Power supply I am not sure that POE is the best approach for crunching RPi 4 with "high" energy need, in particular if the powering switch has to mainly supply "high" consumption devices. In case of a RPi farm, I would prefer to use a PC PSU, which will have sufficient spare power and be more efficient than the small USB power supply. - Headless Because I use boincTasks - which is a very convenient and great tool - I operate all my RPi headless: supervising them with boincTasks and performing maintenance via the CLI using ssh. For crunching RPI, I need a screen for low level trouble shooting only (what finally very rarely happen). Cheers, Yves |
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BobbyB
Veteran Cruncher Canada Joined: Apr 25, 2020 Post Count: 609 Status: Offline Project Badges:
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It's good that you mentioned boincTasks for headless. I knew there was a program to do this but could not remember which. He is going to need it.
https://efmer.com/boinctasks/ Now all the parts to get this project into production are in this thread somewhere. |
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