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twilyth
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Connection frequency setting

In advanced mode, under preferences -> network tab -> 'connect every'

what is the valid range of values?

It seems that if I set to less than .1 days (2.4hrs) that the setting is ignored.

Also, is the behavior different between the WCG approved BOINC version and current BOINC versions?
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[Sep 30, 2009 10:20:54 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Ingleside
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Re: Connection frequency setting

In advanced mode, under preferences -> network tab -> 'connect every'

what is the valid range of values?

Zero to infinity...

But, in practice, if "Connected..." > deadline, you will only get work if idle cpu, so for WCG any setting > 10 days will mean zero cached work...

The highly recommended, and the BOINC-default is, if you've got a permanent connection, "Computer is connected to the Internet about every N days" should be set to zero. (BOINC Manager has a little different wording...) Use "Additional..." to set desired cache-size.

For users with non-permanent connections, the recommended is to set "Connected..." >= expected disconnected-interwall, since "Connected..." is used in cpu-scheduling-decisions. Also, it will stop client downloading work with too short deadline to be returned due to the disconnect-interwall.

It seems that if I set to less than .1 days (2.4hrs) that the setting is ignored.

Also, is the behavior different between the WCG approved BOINC version and current BOINC versions?

"Connected..." is used when it comes to:
1: Cache-size, when cached work drops below the sum of "Connected..." + "Additional..." more work is asked.
2: When needs to run "high priority". If at all possible, BOINC-client will try to finish all tasks atleast "Connected..." before the deadline.
3: Any "ready to report"-task is reported if less than "Connected..." to deadline.

There are some differences between BOINC-versions on the behaviour, these are:
a: BOINC-version v5.10.13 and earlier, any "ready to report"-task is reported if been "ready to report" for "Connected...". (some users uses this with example 0.01-days to report results nearly immediately after finished, but the config-option report_results_immediately was introduced to handle this).
b: v6.6.xx and later clients, always try to keep "Connected..." work on client, even if this means asking for work from low-resource-share projects with large negative LTD.

If you're not running multi-project, I'm not aware of any significant differences in how "Connected..." behaves on any of the v5.10.14 - v6.10.xx-clients.
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by Ingleside at Oct 1, 2009 12:01:20 AM]
[Sep 30, 2009 11:54:16 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
twilyth
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Re: Connection frequency setting

I thought cache size was set by the "additional work buffer" option. That works fine - I have it set to 5 days.

I don't understand your reply regarding the connection frequency. I can tell you for a fact that values like 0.01 or 0.02 simply do not work. If set to those values, i will often have 4 or more completed wu's awaiting upload/reporting. So the low value is definitely more than .01.

It's not really important, 2.4hrs is fine for my purposes and I can live with that. But it would be nice to know what the minimum value that is recognized is. .01 sounds absurd but it only works out to about 15minutes.

I'll look into the 'report results immediately' option, but I can't seem to find the cc_config.xml file on my computer.

edit: I'm re-reading your response. I have an "always on" connection. My guess is that below 0.1, BOINC interprets this as 0 and therefore you get whatever the default happens to be. I'll try .051 and see what happens. If it still connects every 2.4 hours or so (judged by completion times) then it probably only looks at one decimal place and either truncates or rounds up for 2 or more decimal places.
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by twilyth at Oct 1, 2009 12:38:08 AM]
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Sekerob
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Re: Connection frequency setting

twylith,

That config option was specifically (re)activated for those that for instance re-image machines daily i.e. if they shut down they get wiped. Do not use if you don't re-image. Hammers the servers. (Think a longer while back the same discussion about multiple RtR's took place with you).

Similarly, there is an abort on exit, so results that were not finished are signaled back to the server as never getting completed so they can be immediately reissued rather than sitting there to expire.

WCG sets the preset profiles for Connect to 0.1 and cache to 0.2, which results in a theoretical total work in progress (remaining time) + cached work of around 0.3 days i.e. 7.2 hours.

What the bottom value is when it looses meaning. Well, the actual result files are uploaded anyhow asap when there is a connection regardless of this setting. It just controls the reporting to the scheduler, phase 2 of the cycle, with about 7-10 rules attached to this how soon, such as new work fetch and the 24 hours completed rules. See FAQ's for this.
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by Sekerob at Oct 1, 2009 12:54:46 AM]
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twilyth
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Re: Connection frequency setting

twylith,

That config option was specifically (re)activated for those that for instance re-image machines daily i.e. if they shut down they get wiped. Do not use if you don't re-image. Hammers the servers. (Think a longer while back the same discussion about multiple RtR's took place with you).

Similarly, there is an abort on exit, so results that were not finished are signaled back to the server as never getting completed so they can be immediately reissued rather than sitting there to expire.

WCG sets the preset profiles for Connect to 0.1 and cache to 0.2, which results in a theoretical total work in progress (remaining time) + cached work of around 0.3 days i.e. 7.2 hours.

What the bottom value is when it looses meaning. Well, the actual result files are uploaded anyhow asap when there is a connection regardless of this setting. It just controls the reporting to the scheduler, phase 2 of the cycle, with about 7-10 rules attached to this how soon, such as new work fetch and the 24 hours completed rules. See FAQ's for this.

I don't know what RtR means so it probably wasn't me.

as I've said, with .01 it does NOT report ASAP as you seem to be saying. Judging by the completion times, several hours have elapsed. I will try to make a more careful note in the future so I can report more accurate figures. I do know the time since completion was >2.4hrs.

I've disabled the 'report results immediately' feature.

I will keep it set on .051 and see if it rounds up to .1 or down to 0. At .1 I should have no completed jobs older than 2.4 hours. When set to that value it seems to work. The only question for me is for smaller values.
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Sekerob
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Re: Connection frequency setting

RtR is Ready to Report, which are the lines you see building in the Tasks view. There are the 7-10 rules depending on the BOINC version. By itself RtR's are not immediately reported simply because there is no need and at that improves efficiency at the server side.

As for the default, just checked in a test profile and it's 0.2 days connect and 0.3, so 0.5 total.

I just wonder if this lowest value causes the core client to do allot more, taking cycles. Certainly, if always connected is on, it "connect every..." looses its value and just becomes a part of the total buffer equation, but Spock logic does not necessarily apply in Berkeley.

Again, the Result files you see in the transfer window are not held. They are send up ASAP. It's the RtR's that will collect so the server scheduler does not have to do all the whirring of updating the DB and setting the validators in motion on each completion. Latter are paused at times anyhow, to allow other processes to catch up... imagine 425,000 separate reporting contacts... one every 0.2 seconds. Imagine a project that has few minute tasks facing immediately clearing, so thanks for keeping that option off.
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twilyth
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Re: Connection frequency setting

I had actually remembered that there is a difference between completed and ready to report. Try not to look so shocked. biggrin

I've never paid much attention to the former since it's not relevant to points calculations. In other words, the data has to be reported before a 'completed task' message can be sent, but you don't get awarded points until it is.

Of course you still have to await validation and such, but the sending of the RtR gets you in the queue for tagging the WU as valid, inconclusive or whatever. Although now that I think about it, I guess that process could start once the data is sent. Either way, no RtR, no points.

The only reason I looked into this was that I was getting wide swings in the number of points awarded daily. That offended my sense of symmetry. A reporting interval of 2.4 hours should be adequate to even things out and shouldn't put an undue burden on the servers considering that the default is .2.

right now i'm just curious about the minimum value BOINC will recognize so the experiment is just a pleasant little distraction.
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JmBoullier
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Re: Connection frequency setting

To make it simple, for WCG-only members with a permanent connection to the network the "Connect" parameter has no influence on when and how often the BOINC client will contact the servers.
The result files for a job completing will be packed and uploaded immediately after.
And the reporting of jobs "ready to report" will be done the next time the client will need to ask for more jobs.
The client will not report jobs "ready to report" without requesting new work unless one of these jobs is close to its deadline or if there has not been any need for such contacts during 24 hours.

So, for such members, to avoid undesirable effects of high values of this parameter on job scheduling and jobs delivery by the server, simply set the "Connect" parameter to a low value (0 is fine) and forget it.
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twilyth
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Re: Connection frequency setting

If it has no effect on RtR's or the final data for a work unit, why is it there?
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Ingleside
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Re: Connection frequency setting

If it has no effect on RtR's or the final data for a work unit, why is it there?

A setting of example 0.1 have little or no practical effects, if you're not either running multiple projects, or is running an old BOINC-client (example v5.10.13).

A setting of example 9.7 on the other hand will have significant effects, since all WCG-tasks will run "High priority", and all RtR's will be reported immediately, due to there being less than 9.7 days until the deadline...

As for "cache size", this is the sum of "Connected..." and "Additional...".

So, if example one of them is 1 day and the other is 4 days, the cache-size is 5 days.
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