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Category: Support Forum: Suggestions / Feedback Thread: It is time to move to CUDA/BOINC !!!! |
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Thread Status: Active Total posts in this thread: 87
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KerSamson
Master Cruncher Switzerland Joined: Jan 29, 2007 Post Count: 1671 Status: Offline Project Badges: |
Hi KahunaBob,
----------------------------------------your assessment is not correct. Boinc is only the Grid Computing task manager on your PC. Boinc does not compute anything related to the project. In order to take advantage of CUDA or similar technology, the research application must be adapted. Such improvements require a lot of time and effort, in particular because WCG projects are very different, using various research software (autodock, charrm, etc.). Some of these software have been developed in C others in Fortran, ... Not supporting CUDA at WCG is not a missing "good will", it is an ambitious team work between WCG-techs and scientists requesting with sufficient resources. Enjoy computing for WCG, cheers, Yves |
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Former Member
Cruncher Joined: May 22, 2018 Post Count: 0 Status: Offline |
That's a good point. Most of the programing here is done in C right?
Any of it done in C++? NVIDIA has been working on C++ compilers for CUDA so you can program it in C++ and run it on a CUDA enabled device. Just thought it was worth mentioning! |
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cristipurdel
Senior Cruncher Joined: Dec 13, 2008 Post Count: 158 Status: Offline Project Badges: |
Is there any beta going on for OpenCL? I would really like to use my 4650 mobility for some OpenCL beta testing.
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Sekerob
Ace Cruncher Joined: Jul 24, 2005 Post Count: 20043 Status: Offline |
Not at WCG, maybe at other GPU utilizing projects.
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Former Member
Cruncher Joined: May 22, 2018 Post Count: 0 Status: Offline |
Sorry if this is bothersome sekerob, but "not at WCG to which part?"
OpenCL or C++? |
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Former Member
Cruncher Joined: May 22, 2018 Post Count: 0 Status: Offline |
@Otis11 - OpenCL as WCG has no GPU projects (yet).
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David_J_Martin
Cruncher FRANCE Joined: Nov 23, 2005 Post Count: 13 Status: Offline Project Badges: |
Hi KahunaBob, your assessment is not correct. Boinc is only the Grid Computing task manager on your PC. Boinc does not compute anything related to the project. In order to take advantage of CUDA or similar technology, the research application must be adapted. Such improvements require a lot of time and effort, in particular because WCG projects are very different, using various research software (autodock, charrm, etc.). Some of these software have been developed in C others in Fortran, ... Not supporting CUDA at WCG is not a missing "good will", it is an ambitious team work between WCG-techs and scientists requesting with sufficient resources. Enjoy computing for WCG, cheers, Yves I understand the time and effort required [possibly not the magnitude] - but I think most would agree that the number of GPU's that can be used CUDA or otherwise is growing fast. It would seem to me that if a new project started only supporting GPU's then this project would attract a lot of support - especially if it were simple to allocate resorces seperatly for GPU/CPU. [Which I think is possible with BOINC later releases]. Hoping to get my under employed CUDA GPU an almost full time job. David. |
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sk..
Master Cruncher http://s17.rimg.info/ccb5d62bd3e856cc0d1df9b0ee2f7f6a.gif Joined: Mar 22, 2007 Post Count: 2324 Status: Offline Project Badges: |
Now may not be a good time to introduce CUDA.
The WCG is busy. The scientists have just finished 3 projects and are readying one or two more. The technology is also developing and their might need to be more commonality between ATI and NVIDIA before it will be worth pushing out tasks from here. There are many practical issue to consider, such as variants of card capability to use, which could change soon. Most GPU tasks from other projects have stopped using Compute Capable 1.0 cards and now only use 1.1 or 1.3. The Milkyway project has opted to only use CC 1.3 cards. That is a GTX260 or better! They are not cheap, so the number of users is quite small relative to the number of CPUs capable of running Boinc and WCG tasks. Dont think these top card numbers will grow either, they will not! NVidia have stopped manufacturing all but the GTX295, in preparation for their new range (perhaps out before the turn of the year). Who knows what they will bring, and you would be somewhat foolish to produce tasks designed to run on CC1.1 on a 2 or 3year project! By the end there might not be enough people using the cards. Although NVidia are still producing lower powered cards, all CC 1.1, their performance is no-where near that of a top end card, so there really is no point in writing code to run tasks on a graphics cards that are not any faster than a CPU. Take the Nvidia ION or the Geforce 8600M for example., These have a Boinc rating of 6 and 5 GFlops respectively (not the same as other rating systems). These would not be faster than an good quad core CPU. In fact a GTX260 would be about 20X as fast as either. Then there are the mid ranged cards, the 8800s and up, or the more eco cards. They all present issues to the programmer. Card use in itself might make a complete mockery of the badge and points systems. The badges would lose any meaning, so what would be their point? Dont get me wrong, I am in favour of GPU computing and support it, my one GTX260 does at least 3 times more work than 3 quad core CPU systems, and I have other cards. It is however difficult to do, frustrating to implement and might not be worth it, just yet! The WCG runs lots of projects and most are not adaptable towards GPU computing, at the minute. They need to continue to support the existing projects before going down a different road. When GPU computing does develop further, and it will, it might be more usable for projects at the WCG. Let the techies and scientist that actually run the WCG decide what is best for the WCG, they know about it too! For now turn your cards towards Folding@home or the GPUGRID. They do good work too, and are GPU specialists. |
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Former Member
Cruncher Joined: May 22, 2018 Post Count: 0 Status: Offline |
Just to add a few words as a scientist involved in the HCMD2 project.
----------------------------------------These things may have already been said but it must be clear for everyone that CUDA/OpenCL shouldn't be seen as a kind of "universal overclocking" possibility. The massive parallelism provided by GPU is efficient only for a small amount of algorithms. Even if one has to deal with such an algorithm, one has to figure out if it would be pertinent to actually implement it on a specific project because there are other factors, like moving blocks of data to & from the GPU, that are highly inefficient. Thus the global benefit may not be spectacular and absolutely not worth the time of developing (and debugging+supporting !!!) specific code. Moreover, one must understand that porting part of a project to GPU doesn't consist in re-compiling the existing code with another compiler, but really consists in re-thinking how to implement (i.e rewrite from scratch) the algorithms in a way suited for GPU (whenever it's possible). This is obviously time-consuming and also has a cost (time, new hardware, human resources, etc.). At the moment, I'm personally seeing those technologies as "toys" to play with but absolutely not as standards. In my spare time, I have begun to port in CUDA some part of the code used by HCMD2 but, believe me, the task was too huge. Things are evolving very fast in this area. One must be careful when deciding to focus a project, team and money, on such a young technology. [Edit 3 times, last edit by Former Member at Oct 26, 2009 10:41:32 PM] |
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voidcomp
Cruncher Joined: Sep 20, 2009 Post Count: 23 Status: Offline Project Badges: |
It would seem to me that if a new project started only supporting GPU's then this project would attract a lot of support Actually, the fact WCG *only* supports cpu's is the reason I run it. Notwithstanding the benefits of cuda, etc the badges/points are more meaningful from a comparative standpoint when universally cpu driven, at least within project. The point system for Boinc as a whole is all but broken, no sense breaking it even more. |
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