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Sgt.Joe
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Re: Change to the Project Progress Bars

I have read all of the comments. I agree with parts of them. I am very displeased with the new "progress bars" on the Research page. That being said, I am not going to leave WCG because of this change. I think the research in all the areas is too important, especially in the cancer projects because I have a vested interest. Somewhere, I recall reading that one of the criteria for getting a project approved for crunching on WCG is a concept(statement ?) of the scope of the project. I realize the potential scope of any of the projects can be quite open ended. However, I am pretty sure any project with a potential scope in excess of some arbitrary number - such as 25 years - may have to scale back the project. Heaven knows in many areas projects can last much longer despite throwing countless computing cycles at the problem. All that being said, it would be nice to know what the potential scope of a project might be at the start of the project and how that potential scope may periodically change over time. I believe the Drug Search for Leishmaniasis project was terminated early at least partly because the scope of the project ballooned over time.
At least knowing the initial scope of the project would allow some indication of how long the project may last. With the new knowledge from the first six months to a year of crunching on a project some new estimate of the scope may be inferred and hopefully communicated to the volunteers. I don't think this is too much to ask, not from the techs, but from the scientists who actually are in charge of the project.
This project can not continue without the goodwill of IBM, nor can it continue to provide useful contributions to the affected scientific community without the participation of the volunteers. Therefore, I think it would be in the best interest of all concerned to to provide something better than what currently exists on the Research page.
Cheers
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Sgt. Joe
*Minnesota Crunchers*
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Sabrina Tarson
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Re: Change to the Project Progress Bars

I agree with many of the other posters here, with the new changes, the page might as well not exist, as all the projects are going to basically be either "In Progress" or "Completed".

I would much rather prefer loosely made estimates, rather than no indication what so ever. It was always neat to see how much data was processed for a project, if anything just a slight estimated glance, rather than having no guess whatsoever.

I also think it's a bit irritating that these changes are never done with any surveys on the community. As others have mentioned as well, posting the monthly updates somewhere other than the forums would give them much more views.

In the past I never gave the lack of communication much thought, as for the most part I never had a problem with the levels of communication between those running the project, and us actually...running the projects. But after a few years of contributing to other projects, and seeing their outreach with their communities, the World Community Grid still is lacking, and decisions like these being made with no option for the community to have any decision on it before hand only solidifies that opinion.

This especially goes along with the option to just kill the API as well. It would have been one thing to just not display it on the page to not confuse normal visitors, but to leave it for those who actually knew how to represent the data as a guess.

I dunno, this isn't going to make me consider leaving in any capacity, but it does rub me the wrong way. I think especially because over the last couple of years I started to see the communication improve with the community with the monthly project updates, and then to see this happen with no community input is just...more of the same old way.
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KLiK
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Re: Change to the Project Progress Bars

Don't know about you guys, but this weekend has been a reflexion to me how I want to continue donating to WCG - with all my machines crunching 24+ days per day.

& I've come to the conclusion, as hard as it is, but got to 1 ESTIMATE. This one is pretty accurate one & it's pretty sure, concerning my future days here.

The ECD goes: if things don't change (back) for the better (or to include ECDs back in any way), from 1st of July I will be only a memory here. cool
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oldies:UDgrid.org & PS3 Life@home


non-profit org. Play4Life in Zagreb, Croatia
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Dayle Diamond
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Re: Change to the Project Progress Bars

I'm living in a microhome while dedicating 64 desktop threads to World Community Grid. No, I don't have AC. Yes, it gets hot.

In return, I want status reports.

If IBM and project staff were giving a similar percentage of their income and comfort to each cause, I suspect they would feel entitled to status reports. It's not a distraction - it's literally the least you can do.
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by Dayle Diamond at May 19, 2019 9:10:17 PM]
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Deluxe_Cabinets_And_Granite
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Re: Change to the Project Progress Bars

The current system is too 'course' and lacks the previous useful information
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NixChix
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Re: Change to the Project Progress Bars

Chase Tarson wrote:
I agree with many of the other posters here, with the new changes, the page might as well not exist, as all the projects are going to basically be either "In Progress" or "Completed".
Past practice has been that when projects are completed they are removed from the page, so you will not see "Completed" either. You don't see any completed projects now. There will be only 3 indications: "Just Launched", "In Progress" and "Nearly Completed". It would seem that 98% of the time it will show "In Progress", just like now.

Cheers sad

[edited to correct typo]
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by NixChix at May 20, 2019 2:56:51 PM]
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Glen David Short
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Re: Change to the Project Progress Bars

I don't wish to sound disrespectful to the techs and administrators. We appreciate they are underpaid and overworked! And busy getting the new climate change projects up and running. But... while we acknowledge that maintaining the old progress bars and weathering the previous criticisms that came with the old system was a drain on resources, and was not 100% accurate, has anyone done a cost-benefit analysis? So many people here have commented on how demotivating the new system is. Some have even threatened to quit. And who knows how many are unhappy but have not said anything, but are considering turning off their machines. Without mentioning names, less than a week after this monumental change, there are crunchers commenting in this thread who are donating 115, 124, and 340 days of computing time per day who are very unhappy! That was unknown before the change, but now it is crystal clear. So time spent restoring and maintaining the old system will deliver huge benefits to the project overall in terms of cruncher goodwill and computing time gained vrs tech time spent bringing the old system back, or putting in place something better than the kindergarten level system we have now. Nobody says WCG is perfect, its cutting edge in many ways, and you have to try new ideas all the time. No disgrace at all if some of these new ideas don't work. My point being is this new system was worth a try, but seems it is causing more harm than good, so time to try something else, or please, please bring back the old system. Or least something that gives us a rough ball park idea of how much longer a project will run.
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Former Member
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Re: Change to the Project Progress Bars

OK, here's an idea:

If the Research page is there to show the progress of research, then fine. Let it show the progress in terms of the simple stages of the project as it now is. (I do think the WCG team needs to re-think the handling of completed, and perhaps stalled, projects though.)

But many crunchers are clearly unhappy about the lack of information on WU's available. They need this information in order to make decisions about which projects to give how much of their resources to. This is far more important for the big players, but is still relevant to many others. WCG had this data, but complained that it gave rise to support calls. So where and how can this information be provided without confusing occasional site visitors?

I suggest that the information go on the project statistics page instead. You've got to be fairly serious to go and look there. I don't use the APIs that have been made available, and some people have complained that the old "progress" data has been removed from that. You have to be fairly geeky to go and look at the stats, so if it's there, and if the API is reinstated, then doesn't that meet many of everybody's criteria?

I also keep raising the need to make it very clear as to what the information refers. It may help if a statement along the lines of "% of known, currently available batches -- does not reflect project end date" is needed on-screen as well.

Yes, it's more work for the techs, but it's looking like this is getting important. Perhaps IBM will give the WCG team a Summer internee to help ... ?
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Former Member
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Re: Change to the Project Progress Bars

Talked about this before, the vanished milestones bar on the individual research pages, was just curious how/where to find out when that first segment was achieved... just launched. E.g. When did MIP go live... Is it a secret that the last project launch was on or before August 2017, at least, that seems to be the oldest post in the MIP forum?
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katoda
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Poland
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Re: Change to the Project Progress Bars

AFAIK API holds this information, e.g.
https://www.worldcommunitygrid.org/api/project?shortName=mip1
releaseDate "2017-08-22T00:00:00"

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