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Former Member
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Re: Retail Support

Nice long nega list, but boinc is running default only when computer is not used and only after a delay of 20 minutes? Also the cpu time setting is 50 percent and is in latest clients sub-second. Then the bw speed allowed can be limited to not be impairing anything. Tax deductability is probably in full. Who would ever know, best buy on top a partner of wcg for the good as are hundreds of other partners that went before. Makes this anything else related left standing of that list?
[Mar 24, 2014 6:31:37 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Former Member
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Re: Retail Support

Did we forget that the faah bw to time ratio is absolutely minimal and cep2 is opt-in? A little project coaching and away boinc goes. Of course the one element that is inconvenient to some, and not necessarily,, it's about fighting aids. Might not be seen as welcome on the bb screensaver., but can be easily customized too.
[Mar 24, 2014 7:03:05 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Former Member
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Re: Retail Support

Nice long nega list, but boinc is running default only when computer is not used and only after a delay of 20 minutes? Also the cpu time setting is 50 percent and is in latest clients sub-second. Then the bw speed allowed can be limited to not be impairing anything. Tax deductability is probably in full. Who would ever know, best buy on top a partner of wcg for the good as are hundreds of other partners that went before. Makes this anything else related left standing of that list?


The list is just a list of reason.

How can you limit the BW setting when there would be thousands and thousands of machines and they have no idea what congestion there really is. The BW setting is local and nothing more. Tax deduction, based upon what? In order to write it off (even if it was allowed) would require proof; good luck with that. The computer used X watts but Y watts were used for BOINC. The IRS would say prove it and then they couldn't so the deduction would be denied.

After the Target breach, do you really think a retailer is going to be installing third-party software?

You keep thinking in terms of a little bandwidth here and a little bandwidth there is no big deal. A 1Gb connection a corporation would use costs many thousands of dollars per month and the firewall to support is many tens of thousands of dollars. Then you have the back-haul for, that costs many thousands of dollars every month as well. All of those little bits of data really adds up when you are talking thousands upon thousands of machines. Sometimes the client misbehaves and takes manual intervention. I have had a few machines where the client needed to be reinstalled as it just refused to send completed work.

Why don't you offer to pay for the additional bandwidth and other costs to support it?
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[Edit 2 times, last edit by Former Member at Mar 25, 2014 4:08:03 AM]
[Mar 25, 2014 4:01:07 AM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Former Member
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Re: Retail Support

Nice long nega list, but boinc is running default only when computer is not used and only after a delay of 20 minutes? Also the cpu time setting is 50 percent and is in latest clients sub-second. Then the bw speed allowed can be limited to not be impairing anything. Tax deductability is probably in full. Who would ever know, best buy on top a partner of wcg for the good as are hundreds of other partners that went before. Makes this anything else related left standing of that list?


The list is just a list of reason.

How can you limit the BW setting when there would be thousands and thousands of machines and they have no idea what congestion there really is. The BW setting is local and nothing more. Tax deduction, based upon what? In order to write it off (even if it was allowed) would require proof; good luck with that. The computer used X watts but Y watts were used for BOINC. The IRS would say prove it and then they couldn't so the deduction would be denied.

After the Target breach, do you really think a retailer is going to be installing third-party software?

You keep thinking in terms of a little bandwidth here and a little bandwidth there is no big deal. A 1Gb connection a corporation would use costs many thousands of dollars per month and the firewall to support is many tens of thousands of dollars. Then you have the back-haul for, that costs many thousands of dollars every month as well. All of those little bits of data really adds up when you are talking thousands upon thousands of machines. Sometimes the client misbehaves and takes manual intervention. I have had a few machines where the client needed to be reinstalled as it just refused to send completed work.

Why don't you offer to pay for the additional bandwidth and other costs to support it?


you seem to think the infrastructure is not there. I only suggested they add Boinc to 10 to 15 computers per store. in the computer sales section, where the computers are ALREADY turned on, and ALREADY connected to the web for the browsing enjoyment of customers.

Other then that, you feel that Boinc does not offer enough services. OK. I agree, Boinc needs improvement before its ready for an implementation like this. That will happen. thats where Boinc works with the major corporations to give them a useable product.
[Mar 25, 2014 4:23:17 AM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
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Re: Retail Support

15 per store = 22,500 computers total. Add in an average probably at least three cores and that is a lot of WU's. Each store has a proxy which does the WU's no good at all.

You do realize that a computer at idle takes less power than a computer at 50% or even 100%, right? The higher the CPU utilization, the more the fans work, the more the fans work, the more noise it makes. They are in the business to sell computers, keep that in mind.
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Re: Retail Support

Why not petition Microsoft, Google. Yahoo, Amazon, Rackspace, etc. to run it in their data centers? Microsoft alone has 1 million servers which is less than Google. 22,500 is nothing compared to that. See what reaction you get from the above.
[Mar 25, 2014 5:24:17 AM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
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Re: Retail Support

Why not petition Microsoft, Google. Yahoo, Amazon, Rackspace, etc. to run it in their data centers? Microsoft alone has 1 million servers which is less than Google. 22,500 is nothing compared to that. See what reaction you get from the above.

I petitioned those store as I know they have computers that are in public view that are doing nothing. I have petitioned microsoft and was considering amazon. But then those other stores have less motivation and I dont know what computers to suggest they put it on.
Obviously it would be good to get them onto boinc. I just dont know underwhat settings that would work.
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by Former Member at Mar 25, 2014 5:42:27 AM]
[Mar 25, 2014 5:40:52 AM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
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Re: Retail Support

So you are making a “recommendation” but yet don’t know the impact of that recommendation.

Those computers are not just sitting idle; they are actually doing something; to sell computers. Having a computer sit there with its fan spun up to expel heat. That would put many consumers off as they would think that is “normal” for that computer sitting there and doing nothing. Sure you could put signs up but the average consumer wouldn’t actually understand. Depending on the CPU, at load it can consume 60% more power. Take a system with an i5-4670; 79 watts at idle and 132 watts at load for a difference if 53 watts. 15 computers across all of their stores is 22,500 computers in total; 53 * 22,500 = 1,192,500 additional watts or 1,192.5 kilowatts of electricity. Electricity rates vary across the country and Best Buy would get a commercial rate which could be as low as a $0.01 but as high as $0.06. Let’s use $0.02, which would result in $572.40. Would you want to pay that? Oh, that is per day too, per year it is over $200,000. In the summer all that additional heat produced by the computers, yep, they need to pay more to cool the stores. There are many retailers that the holiday season is when they make their money and the other three quarters of the year they just get by. Shall we look at the Q4 2013 earnings for Best Buy? Net loss of $377 million; which is better than the $405 million net loss Q4 2012 though. Do you really think a company struggling will be willing to spend over $16,000 per month per store? If Best Buy actually cared about their image, they wouldn’t be known for what they are known for. Also with retailer feeling the pressure from on-line sales, paying higher overhead does little to offset the cost disadvantage. Apple has the highest profit margin on their products but image is everything to them. They would not want computer sitting there pumping out heat, getting hot and fans spinning up; they want to show how quiet their machines are. Running BOINC on them would be counterproductive in that. So the display machines on the floor are doing exactly what they are intended to do, sell machines, not cure disease.
For Microsoft to run that software in their data centers it would cost them around $5 million in electricity costs alone, not to mention the cooling cost required. You also have only so much power to each rack; that would be over 4 additional kilowatts per rack. Other issues would be the generators on-site may not be capable of providing all those additional watts or possibly even the feed from the power company. If they had 1000 racks of servers, that would be over 4 megawatts of additional electrical power. Care to guess how many homes that can run?
[Mar 25, 2014 2:45:57 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Mgruben
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Re: Retail Support

Corporations are legally-birthed entities wherein some people contribute money that they expect will grow through the corporation's activities and other people oversee these activities.

Those overseeing the activities (the "board") are legally-obligated not to do things which will waste the money of the people who have contributed.

We know what a corporation has made or has wasted by recording all its activities on massive spreadsheets (accounting).

Corporations don't know how to account for the gain posed by things like, among other things, (1) being environmentally conscious, (2) paying more for better working conditions for its laborers, and (3) running distributed computing projects on its own hardware and with its own maintenance. There are movements to include these things in corporations' accounting

Corporations do make donations (we're discussing this topic on an IBM forum), but this is largely because the board thinks this will net more money in the long run. There's a famous case that explains why corporations generally don't altruistically engage in what many of us would consider to be nice, sensible actions.

Additionally, if a corporation wants to donate, it's much easier accounting-wise for it to simply disburse a lump-sum of cash to some cause and record that single transaction, rather than for it to calculate how much wear its equipment suffers by running distributed computing, investing in cooling and other maintenance, maintaining and updating the software, and deploying and removing that software at the appropriate time.

tl;dr: companies are legally selfish and probably wouldn't see any benefit in your proposal though that's nonsensical and I support the implementation of your idea even if it would mean changing corporate law around.
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[Mar 25, 2014 3:15:24 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Coleslaw
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Re: Retail Support

Why not petition Microsoft, Google. Yahoo, Amazon, Rackspace, etc. to run it in their data centers? Microsoft alone has 1 million servers which is less than Google. 22,500 is nothing compared to that. See what reaction you get from the above.


Microsoft already uses their data centers for DC applications when they can spin it to their favor. MS Prime Numbers Search I'm sure if you could make a strong enough case, they would do it for WCG as well.
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