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twilyth
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Re: babies

And Dolly was not without problems.
Cheers

But you probably don't have any idea why. Here's one possibility - telomeres .
Some in the press speculated that a contributing factor to Dolly's death was that she could have been born with a genetic age of six years, the same age as the sheep from which she was cloned.[17] One basis for this idea was the finding that Dolly's telomeres were short, which is typically a result of the ageing process.[18][19] The Roslin Institute have stated that intensive health screening did not reveal any abnormalities in Dolly that could have come from advanced aging.[17]

The thing that's overlooked in that quote is that telomeres probably aren't the primary cause of aging. In fact no one really understands what is. However once a telomere shortens to a certain length, the cell becomes senescent. It's call the Hayflick limit

The institute that cloned Dolly however claims that shorter telomeres weren't the cause but even they admit that her's were shorter than would be expected for an animal her age. Their argument is that telomere length is restored by the cloning process but I suspect there is some doubt about that given that you're starting with a somatic (body) cell.

edit: The bottom line is that cloning is a very different process than starting with a normal embryo. I only made the association to show you that this technique of transplanting the nucleus from one cell to another is very old news. I wasn't trying to argue it wouldn't have any repercussions. Maybe you were trying to change the subject though?
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[Edit 2 times, last edit by twilyth at Feb 27, 2014 12:08:16 AM]
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Sgt.Joe
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Re: babies

But you probably don't have any idea why.

Actually I did. I remember reading that at the time of Dolly's death.
Maybe you were trying to change the subject though?

Not trying to change the subject. I think my point was we, as a society, have ventured into realms for which we have not fully explored the repercussions and consequences, intended or otherwise. I am all for research (one of the reasons I am here) but with the caveat that all that we find is not necessarily benevolent. We need to understand not only the technical aspects of the research, but also all the other aspects.
Cheers
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Sgt. Joe
*Minnesota Crunchers*
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twilyth
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Re: babies

But you probably don't have any idea why.

Actually I did. I remember reading that at the time of Dolly's death.
Maybe you were trying to change the subject though?

Not trying to change the subject. I think my point was we, as a society, have ventured into realms for which we have not fully explored the repercussions and consequences, intended or otherwise. I am all for research (one of the reasons I am here) but with the caveat that all that we find is not necessarily benevolent. We need to understand not only the technical aspects of the research, but also all the other aspects.
Cheers
And my point was that this isn't anything new from a technical perspective. Nuclear transfer is a technique that's been around for decades. Maybe I should have been clearer that I was talking about the technique but I certainly never argued that the procedure was safe for use on embryos.

I think what has people upset about this is the fact that it's so much like cloning, which is also old news. So this debate has been going on for decades. It's just that now they want to apply nuclear transfer to humans. In fact my guess as to why they've only done partial transfers of mitochondria in the past was due at least in part to a desire to avoid this debate as well as the uncertainties seen with cloned animals.

For example in doing a little research since my last post I found that in some cases you actually get telomeres that are longer than you would normally find in certain species of animals .
So, what happens to the clone if its transferred nucleus is already pretty old? Will the shortened telomeres affect its development or lifespan?

When scientists looked at the telomere lengths of cloned animals, they found no clear answers. Chromosomes from cloned cattle or mice had longer telomeres than normal. These cells showed other signs of youth and seemed to have an extended lifespan compared with cells from a naturally conceived cow. On the other hand, Dolly the sheep's chromosomes had shorter telomere lengths than normal. This means that Dolly's cells were aging faster than the cells from a normal sheep.
That's a pretty interesting page if anyone is interested in the possible side effects of cloning.
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Sgt.Joe
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Re: babies

...a desire to avoid this debate...

We need to have this debate - discussion - examination in an all encompassing view of the subject.
Cheers
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Sgt. Joe
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twilyth
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Re: babies

I'm not sure what you mean, but it looks like the issue is the hands of the FDA now. My guess is that they'll veto it but for desperate couples, I'm sure the procedure will still be performed someplace else in the world. You can't stop technology, even when pursuing it may not be the wisest choice.
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