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World Community Grid Forums
Category: Support
Forum: BOINC Agent Support
Thread: Vina projects invalid gets 100 Points/Hr (Resolved) |
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Thread Status: Active Total posts in this thread: 39
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Former Member
Cruncher Joined: May 22, 2018 Post Count: 0 Status: Offline |
Been seeing alot (20-30%) of my wingmen getting 50-55 points for 0.3 to 0.7 hrs of compute time that always end as invalid. They only claim 12-20 points when reporting, When I return we both go to Pending verification status, when that wu is returned, I get valid and 100-110 points, the short time gets invalid and half points, so a .4 hr wu gets 52 points=130 Points per hr, a valid wu gets about 10 PPH.
----------------------------------------Would not be concerned but this has been happening for the last few weeks, and getting to be a regular thing. At present I have 14 vina IP, 1 PV, and 1 PVal. Of those the PVal and 2 IP will end this way, 18.75% Examples: SN2S_ Smp008070_ 0000236_ 0310_ 3-- - In Progress 4/4/13 21:04:50 4/8/13 21:04:50 0.00 0.0 / 0.0 SN2S_ Smp008070_ 0000236_ 0310_ 2-- 620 Pending Verification 4/1/13 14:54:26 4/4/13 21:04:22 14.72 109.5 / 0.0 SN2S_ Smp008070_ 0000236_ 0310_ 1-- 620 Error 4/1/13 13:42:59 4/1/13 14:53:58 0.00 0.0 / 0.0 SN2S_ Smp008070_ 0000236_ 0310_ 0-- 620 Pending Verification 4/1/13 13:01:31 4/1/13 14:12:04 0.41 16.5 / 0.0 DSFL_ 00070-21_ 0000014_ 1327_ 1-- - In Progress 4/4/13 13:10:53 4/14/13 13:10:53 0.00 0.0 / 0.0 DSFL_ 00070-21_ 0000014_ 1327_ 0-- 625 Pending Validation 4/4/13 12:35:27 4/4/13 13:34:56 0.65 26.4 / 0.0 DSFL_ 00070-21_ 0000028_ 0998_ 1-- - In Progress 4/4/13 19:45:33 4/14/13 19:45:33 0.00 0.0 / 0.0 DSFL_ 00070-21_ 0000028_ 0998_ 0-- 625 Pending Validation 4/4/13 19:45:06 4/4/13 20:44:23 0.71 24.2 / 0.0 The logs are always the same for the short timers: Result Name: DSFL_ 00070-21_ 0000028_ 0998_ 0-- <core_client_version>6.10.25</core_client_version> Nothing more, nothing less. Always 6.10.25, always blank [Edit 2 times, last edit by Former Member at Apr 23, 2013 2:41:37 AM] |
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keithhenry
Ace Cruncher Senile old farts of the world ....uh.....uh..... nevermind Joined: Nov 18, 2004 Post Count: 18667 Status: Offline Project Badges: 
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I think this is not limited to the VINA projects. I'm seeing the same thing with HCC. Wingman runs for about 20 minutes while it takes my machines 3-5 hours. Naturally, these WUs all go into Pending Verification because of the difference. After a third processing by a second wingman, mine always end up as valid. I've not tracked specific WUs to see what happens to the wingman but the wingman's logs are always the same - just the 6.10.25 message and nothing more. Not sure if this is due to a BOINC bug in 6.10.25 or if someone's figured out a way to "boost" their points by forcing invalids or even how many wingmen are involved.
----------------------------------------I've seen a separate problem with HCC WU's getting marked as No Reply for the wingman about 15 minutes after being sent to them. I suspect the server is not getting some sort of confirmation of a successful download. Seeing a good number of these as well. |
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Former Member
Cruncher Joined: May 22, 2018 Post Count: 0 Status: Offline |
Thank you, at least I know I am not seeing things ;) and yes the term "exploit" did cross my mind.
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asdavid
Veteran Cruncher FRANCE Joined: Nov 18, 2004 Post Count: 521 Status: Offline Project Badges: 
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I observed the same, but did not notice before the fact that these invalids are getting more points than valid results.
----------------------------------------you are right one sample: DSFL_ 00070-17_ 0000045_ 0821_ 2-- 625 Valid 01/04/13 07:34:55 04/04/13 11:26:24 5.84 95.6 / 96.0 DSFL_ 00070-17_ 0000045_ 0821_ 1-- 625 Valid 31/03/13 16:06:10 01/04/13 07:33:22 5.14 96.3 / 96.0 DSFL_ 00070-17_ 0000045_ 0821_ 0-- 625 Invalid 31/03/13 16:05:24 31/03/13 16:43:45 0.64 19.7 / 48.0
Anne-Sophie
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Sgt.Joe
Ace Cruncher USA Joined: Jul 4, 2006 Post Count: 7848 Status: Offline Project Badges:
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I do not think this would be much of exploit. If a machine starts to return too many invalids, its supply of WU will be either cutoff for a time or severely restricted. However, on the surface it does look to be a bit strange. I looked at mine and the vast majority of all the Vina projects run with a quorum of 1 with very few pending validation or verification. Of these all of the wingmen were in an"In Progress" state. I would think if some machine(s) were returning an inordinate number of invalids on a consistent basis it would draw the attention of the techs.
----------------------------------------Cheers
Sgt. Joe
*Minnesota Crunchers* |
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bieberj
Senior Cruncher United States Joined: Dec 2, 2004 Post Count: 406 Status: Offline Project Badges: 
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I have seen the same thing - I currently have 4 pending verifications which is unusual for a single system with 2 processors, both of which are doing the crunching.
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gb009761
Master Cruncher Scotland Joined: Apr 6, 2005 Post Count: 3010 Status: Offline Project Badges: 
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I also have been seeing very similar things happening recently - a sharp rise in Pver's for HCC (CPU) WU's, as well as my machine receiving a lot more than usual repair WU's for others who's WU's have gone Pver.
----------------------------------------I know that the HCC project is in it's last stages, although a handful of WU's that currently are in Pver state (and, all have the same kind of symptoms as described above), are as follows; X0930127300529201106070952_ 0-- X0930127300527201106070952_ 1-- X0900126701351201105251100_ 2-- X0960125440247201102091200_ 0--  |
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bieberj
Senior Cruncher United States Joined: Dec 2, 2004 Post Count: 406 Status: Offline Project Badges:
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Here's an interesting one... PV always 6.10.25... Errors are more recent.
----------------------------------------GFAM_ x1CWJ_ hCypA_ 0090465_ 0138_ 5-- - In Progress 4/6/13 09:50:49 4/10/13 09:50:49 0.00 0.0 / 0.0 GFAM_ x1CWJ_ hCypA_ 0090465_ 0138_ 4-- 612 Pending Verification 4/5/13 11:34:20 4/6/13 09:50:07 4.98 93.6 / 0.0 GFAM_ x1CWJ_ hCypA_ 0090465_ 0138_ 3-- 612 Error 4/5/13 11:29:47 4/5/13 11:33:23 0.00 99.8 / 0.0 GFAM_ x1CWJ_ hCypA_ 0090465_ 0138_ 2-- 612 Pending Verification 4/5/13 08:55:27 4/5/13 11:28:59 0.34 14.0 / 0.0 GFAM_ x1CWJ_ hCypA_ 0090465_ 0138_ 1-- 612 Error 4/5/13 08:53:18 4/5/13 08:54:53 0.00 100.3 / 0.0 GFAM_ x1CWJ_ hCypA_ 0090465_ 0138_ 0-- 612 Pending Verification 4/5/13 08:53:03 4/5/13 09:18:00 0.42 85.7 / 0.0 Question: How did that repair wingman end up with a short time? [Edit 1 times, last edit by bieberj at Apr 6, 2013 10:41:41 AM] |
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Former Member
Cruncher Joined: May 22, 2018 Post Count: 0 Status: Offline |
Please fix the hole in the vina validator, currently 40% of my wu will go P(Ver) due to this issue. I am ATM running vina only to get my Blue badge, but starting to question the validity of any vina wu. I know I am only running 5 cores, but really 40% questionable???
To Sgt Joe, as to the quota, PV will increase the quota. Starting at a quota of 1, return it in 20-30 min, quota doubles, get 2 more and continue. you have about 8 hrs (4 for wingman, 4 for P(Ver) wu) until you start returning invalids, could play this for weeks ;) |
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Former Member
Cruncher Joined: May 22, 2018 Post Count: 0 Status: Offline |
I could understand the change to giving 50% credit to invalid results in those circumstances where it was thought that the problem was the application code and not the cruncher's machine. However, in circumstances such as these it certainly appears that the award is excessive. Here's an example from me:
Result Name App Version Number Status Sent Time Time Due / Return Time CPU Time / Elapsed Time (hours) Claimed/ Granted BOINC Credit GFAM_ x1CWJ_ hCypA_ 0090377_ 0099_ 4-- 612 Valid 06/04/13 18:29:29 07/04/13 13:23:03 4.93 87.5 / 91.6 GFAM_ x1CWJ_ hCypA_ 0090377_ 0099_ 3-- 612 Error 06/04/13 18:26:27 06/04/13 18:29:20 0.00 96.5 / 0.0 GFAM_ x1CWJ_ hCypA_ 0090377_ 0099_ 2-- 612 Valid 06/04/13 06:35:07 06/04/13 18:25:38 3.52 95.6 / 91.6 GFAM_ x1CWJ_ hCypA_ 0090377_ 0099_ 1-- 612 Invalid 05/04/13 04:02:30 06/04/13 06:34:45 0.22 9.8 / 45.8 GFAM_ x1CWJ_ hCypA_ 0090377_ 0099_ 0-- 612 Invalid 05/04/13 01:41:53 05/04/13 02:55:35 0.67 26.8 / 45.8 Perhaps the award should be 50% of the awarded or claimed points, whichever is lower. Would that be fair and yet still dissuade those who might seek to exploit this, and not add much work to the servers? Alternatively, perhaps vina project files should not be sent to machines running 6.10.25 in the first place (unless a known bug can be fixed)? |
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