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nicholas-chan
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Easier way to get new people on WCG and into your team?

Right now, to get someone onto WCG, this is the (approximate) following steps:

1. Point them to WCG website
1a. Tell them the website link
1b. Email them from the WCG convulated tell-a-friend page
1c. Email them with a team link from your team page

2. Person goes on the site and registers a userID

3. Person downloads the client and installs it

4. After installation, system reboots and the client asks for the userID

5. Assuming option 1a, 1b is done, there is the added step to give them the link to your team page, of which they then have to click join the team.

In comparison with Dropbox "introduce a friend" workflow which auto-tracks referrals:

1a. Send them a generated link
1b. Mass email your friends via a emailbox

When your friend joins, the system automatically prompts them to install the software, let's the user register into Dropbox VIA the program and then tracks the referral bonus to you (sort of similar to an auto-add into a team idea).

What I am saying is, is there a way for the workflow to be reduced significantly, such as:

1. Send users a link, of which that page they get will automatically get them to download the software
2. The software will ask for the person's email OR assuming they enter another email address, to have a form of session tracking
3. The software will install, and automatically associates the user to the team, automatically configures the userID into the program BEFORE the reboot

Appreciate any insight!
[Jan 31, 2010 7:47:24 AM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Sekerob
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Re: Easier way to get new people on WCG and into your team?

Fear the registering and agreeing to terms and conditions before downloading is one of the things WCG is not likely to change.

In past the team link was send along I think [seems not in the test mail to myself] thus something to consider. An added selection field, yes/no to insert that info may be a way around that. First order is for folk to get crunching, the team join link injectable via the personal message box at the end of the mail to limit it to just one mail from you as promoter. It might be something that WCG could insert in the welcome mail rather than you pushing the team motivation angle... that is, if there was some friend referral tracking in the process.
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[Jan 31, 2010 9:25:29 AM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
nicholas-chan
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Re: Easier way to get new people on WCG and into your team?

I am not saying the need to remove registering/agreeing to T&C, I am saying if it can be all streamlined somewhat to be done on client-side all at the same time *during* installation (ie. installation wizard will show T&C, register account, etc) so there is no need to separate the different tasks.
[Feb 1, 2010 11:03:26 AM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Sekerob
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Re: Easier way to get new people on WCG and into your team?

Maybe you can test this for me: Open the Tell a Friend page. Then change the field name where the member is entered to something your friends know and change the from email address to another, which is not your WCG mail account. Then mail to yourself this message i.e. put yourself in the <i>to</i> box. I tried and never received it back neither on the my grid or my alternate mail account. Only when the WCG account info is left in tact does the mail arrive back to me.

And a idea

Think there should be a copy back to the members mailbox confirming the message was issued... something like <i>thank you for telling your friend</i> as there might otherwise be a possibility to enter George Clooney's from box as transmitter.

The smoothing walks into a wall... BOINC was not designed with the different ways WCG has. For other project you just enter the mail account and password when attaching and it will create the account on the fly. At any rate, I've reported the mailing issue/suggestions. Maybe the custom pack for 6.10 will have additional improvements... a web page forced open in the default browser from the client and some cookie exchanges... but NoScript might not like that :|
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[Feb 1, 2010 11:29:11 AM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Former Member
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Re: Easier way to get new people on WCG and into your team?

Nicholas,

I think this may be what you mean in Step 1c, but one thing you can do to cut out step 5 is to go to: http://www.worldcommunitygrid.org/ms/team/viewMyTeam.do and give them the link at the bottom to the registration page with your team ID already populated. When the member registers, they will be added to the team automatically, thus eliminating Step 5.

Ex: http://www.worldcommunitygrid.org/reg/viewRegister.do?teamID=3G0HC2F7P1

In addition, I think you are oversimplifying the Dropbox process. You still have to download and register. The only difference for World Community Grid is that you register and then download instead of download then register.

As for step 4, this doesn't happen for every user. For people on Windows (using most browsers), the site does exactly as you want in your simplified version. World Community Grid sets cookie which the downloaded software then reads to automatically sign the user in to the software. I believe this doesn't happen on Linux, so perhaps that is the reason you are encountering this.

As for the reboot part of step 4, this is required by the software now because of added security measures in the software. And speaking of security - in order to perform step 1b of the Dropbox referral process, you have to give them your email address and password which is something that World Community Grid has tried to avoid doing because of the security risks it poses, as well as the attitude towards security that it breeds in computer users. People have been much more skeptical regarding security with World Community Grid compared to services like Dropbox because those sites provide what many consider a "necessary" service, where as World Community Grid is something they could very easily live without.
[Feb 2, 2010 10:35:52 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Former Member
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Re: Easier way to get new people on WCG and into your team?

I think th most important feature is Anonymous donation. Just install software and run, change project if you really want, and register user if you really really want. Folding at home has this mode both on PC and PS3 and thats one of the reasons they are having milions of users. Technically we could create anonymous user and just assign it as default once the client is installed. Then we can nag user after for example 1 work unit completed to register IF he wishes to.
[Feb 3, 2010 4:43:25 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
nicholas-chan
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Re: Easier way to get new people on WCG and into your team?

nelsoc,

I understand step 5 can be taken out via the email link; I am just saying that for the various people I try to get onto WCG, the common complaint is "why so many separate steps? Why can't it be like Facebook "add app" and click OK?"

Anyway this is merely just providing feedback. If WCG is not in favour of making the installation process more streamlined, it's their choice. I am merely just trying to get more people on WCG by making it as "Apple-ish" as possible.

I am on Windows XP, and so is the various other people that I installed WCG for them. In all cases, I had to manually enter their userid and password after restarting; there is no cookie.
[Feb 4, 2010 4:52:39 AM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
knreed
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Re: Easier way to get new people on WCG and into your team?

We are interested in improving processes to make the system as easy to use as possible. However here are some things to consider:

1) Once someone registers on the website, 70% of them become active participants. This is an extremely good conversion rate considering that we are asking people to install something on their computer. We of course would love to see this as a higher number, but this biggest challenge is getting people to accept the concept of installing an executable from the internet on their computer. Years of work has been done to drill it into people's heads that installing applications from the internet is a bad idea and the whole concept of volunteer computing is fighting against that. This issue more than any else prevents that 70% from being higher.

2) Firefox changed their method of storing cookies with version 3.0 and up to use the sqllite db. Version 6.2 of BOINC (which we have here) cannot read the cookies. Version 6.10 of BOINC (which we are testing) does.

3) Around 30% of people who return at least one result, quit participating after less than 2 months. One change we hope will help this is that when people set the % cpu use for the client, BOINC limits the science applications to running to that % at most. Work is being done so that the 6.10 (version 6.10.32 and up) will throttle the science applications based upon total system cpu use. Therefore if you are doing some video encoding that is using 50% of your cpu power and BOINC is set to run at most at 60% of cpu power then BOINC will limit the research applications to running only at 10%. There is work being done to try to figure out how to assess if the machine is swapping memory heavily (this can cause slow downs on machines without much memory). The idea is that if the machine starts swapping, then the research applications will be paused for a certain length of time. This one is more complex to implement correctly so it will not make the 6.10 client.

4) We have talked about an 'anonymous client' that people could install. The issue with the anonymous client is that we lose the ability to stay in contact with the person. For example, we have an email that we send 60 days after a user stops contributing. We are able to get 29% of those people to become active again. An anonymous user would not receive that email. If we had the anonymous installer, we would probably get a few more people that we wouldn't have gotten otherwise. However, some of the people that would have created a user id will opt to use the anonymous version. In the long run the anonymous client may result in lower participating overall.

Take a look at this presentation that I gave at the BOINC workshop, it provides some good information: http://boinc.berkeley.edu/trac/attachment/wiki/WorkShop09/wcg.pdf
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by knreed at Feb 4, 2010 3:24:45 PM]
[Feb 4, 2010 3:21:57 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
nicholas-chan
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Re: Easier way to get new people on WCG and into your team?

We are interested in improving processes to make the system as easy to use as possible. However here are some things to consider:

1) Once someone registers on the website, 70% of them become active participants. This is an extremely good conversion rate considering that we are asking people to install something on their computer. We of course would love to see this as a higher number, but this biggest challenge is getting people to accept the concept of installing an executable from the internet on their computer. Years of work has been done to drill it into people's heads that installing applications from the internet is a bad idea and the whole concept of volunteer computing is fighting against that. This issue more than any else prevents that 70% from being higher.


Perhaps I can make another suggestion? Can a rich client approach be used instead? Such that information is pushed to the desktop, rather than relying on the thin hope that users MIGHT log onto the site? Understanding that people find installating software hard, that's why I am thinking of how a clear secured/safe referral method could be used to alleviate fears.

2) Firefox changed their method of storing cookies with version 3.0 and up to use the sqllite db. Version 6.2 of BOINC (which we have here) cannot read the cookies. Version 6.10 of BOINC (which we are testing) does.


That's great, will that new version be out soon?

3) Around 30% of people who return at least one result, quit participating after less than 2 months. One change we hope will help this is that when people set the % cpu use for the client, BOINC limits the science applications to running to that % at most. Work is being done so that the 6.10 (version 6.10.32 and up) will throttle the science applications based upon total system cpu use. Therefore if you are doing some video encoding that is using 50% of your cpu power and BOINC is set to run at most at 60% of cpu power then BOINC will limit the research applications to running only at 10%. There is work being done to try to figure out how to assess if the machine is swapping memory heavily (this can cause slow downs on machines without much memory). The idea is that if the machine starts swapping, then the research applications will be paused for a certain length of time. This one is more complex to implement correctly so it will not make the 6.10 client.


I have had this problem also with some of my friends, they just say they don't see ANYTHING happening, and they feedback that if they can see how their involvement impacts matters via the program, it would let them know just what really happens. The website reports I shown them is not "me" oriented. Understanding that this is more pandering to the individual ego, but I see that in a Facebook era, this "me" issue can be used well.

4) We have talked about an 'anonymous client' that people could install. The issue with the anonymous client is that we lose the ability to stay in contact with the person. For example, we have an email that we send 60 days after a user stops contributing. We are able to get 29% of those people to become active again. An anonymous user would not receive that email. If we had the anonymous installer, we would probably get a few more people that we wouldn't have gotten otherwise. However, some of the people that would have created a user id will opt to use the anonymous version. In the long run the anonymous client may result in lower participating overall.


I think the main option of having anonymous clients is that they would probably be installed by students into computer labs or cybercafes, so these would be more like straggler-type contributions. There is also the ability to "mass mail" out this program (or downloader, like Adobe downloader. Or install over web, like LogMeIn) to friends, and to add people who are otherwise too lazy to bother with the registration and all.

Take a look at this presentation that I gave at the BOINC workshop, it provides some good information: http://boinc.berkeley.edu/trac/attachment/wiki/WorkShop09/wcg.pdf


Great presentation! Good to see the user engagement ideas there, and hopefully more ideas can be put into action in the coming months!
[Feb 6, 2010 7:22:53 AM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
JmBoullier
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Re: Easier way to get new people on WCG and into your team?

I think the main option of having anonymous clients is that they would probably be installed by students into computer labs or cybercafes, so these would be more like straggler-type contributions.
I am not sure if you see this as an advantaget or an inconvenience but it is strictly against the Conditions of Use that WCG be installed in a machine without its owner's agreement.

This is why an anonymous installation is very unlikely to happen (personal opinion only): it is too easy for anybody (not even a geek) to install anywhere without the owner being aware. Most people call such a software a trojan and it is not at all how WCG/IBM wish to be seen.
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[Feb 6, 2010 9:17:20 AM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
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