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Ingleside
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smile Re: Not getting enough work units

With 5.8.x and it's screwy scheduling algorithm, I think you'll end up not getting any new work because BOINC won't ask for it so adding a new project probably won't help there. As I recall, once BOINC 5.8.x thinks you're at risk of missing a deadline, it quits asking for new work until you're crunching on your last WU.

Not quite right, it only blocks work-request from a project as long as the project is in deadline-trouble.

If you've connected to multiple BOINC-projects, you'll normally have a full cache, even one of the projects is currently being blocked.


As for "screwy algorithm", if you're example running with a 4-day cache and each wu takes 5 hours, what is your situation when an unexpected outage starts?
1; You've got 96-100 hours cached.
2; The wu you're currently crunching, was downloaded 96-100 hours ago...

Meaning, if an unexpected outage lasts until your cache is out, 96-100 hours, your oldest unreported result is now... 196 hours old, over 8 days old...

If deadline is example 7 days, it means your oldest result is reported over 1 day after it's deadline is over...

Now, if it's the whole project going down, you still have a chance your too-late results is still useful and you'll get credit, but if it's more local problems like your ISP having problems, chances are the 1+ day of crunching on the 4-day outage was just wasted electricity...

Oh, and in some BOINC-projects like LHC@home and SETI@home, even if it is the whole project going down, chances are wu is already validated by the time your too-late results makes it in, and again you'll get zero credit...

Generally, if the point of the cache is to handle unexpected outages, it's a waste of time to set this cache larger than 1/2 the deadline. V5.8.xx just enforces this fact, but has added an extra 1-day safety. If not mistake, v5.10.xx also enforces this fact, but has removed the 1-day safety...

Planned outages would be different, but most outages is unplanned, so BOINC-client treating everything as unplanned shouldn't make a big difference.
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"I make so many mistakes. But then just think of all the mistakes I don't make, although I might."
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by Ingleside at Aug 7, 2007 12:34:25 PM]
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Re: Not getting enough work units

I'm having a similar problem, and am in a situation where access to the outside world is only allowed during certain hours. I can't cache enough units currently to make it thru the night.

I have all projects selected, and cache 2 days of work normally. Which has been running fine until three days ago.

I don't know that I buy the "deadline trouble" explaination.

Can you tell me which of the items from this screenshot are in deadline troubles?

Tasks Tab Screenshot
[Aug 7, 2007 2:31:55 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Ingleside
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Re: Not getting enough work units

I'm having a similar problem, and am in a situation where access to the outside world is only allowed during certain hours. I can't cache enough units currently to make it thru the night.

I have all projects selected, and cache 2 days of work normally. Which has been running fine until three days ago.

I don't know that I buy the "deadline trouble" explaination.

Can you tell me which of the items from this screenshot are in deadline troubles?

Tasks Tab Screenshot

A new work-scheduler was introduced in v5.8.xx, using:
Computational deadline = report deadline - (Work Buffer size + 1 day + "switch between projects every N hours")
A Task is in deadline trouble if Computational deadline < 0.9 * report deadline

Due to these formulas, the max usable cache-size in v5.8.xx if deadline is only 2 days is... 0.45 days...

For other deadlines, see Work Buffer

In v5.10.xx you've AFAIK still using the same formulas (I should really check this), but without the "1-day" safety, meaning max usable cache-size is around 0.9

So, upgrading to v5.10.13 or later should improve things, but it's possibly you'll still run out of work. Your options then is either to de-select FightAids@home until new application with long deadlines is released, or attach to one or more of the other BOINC-projects.
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Re: Not getting enough work units

Thank you Ingleside, that explains things for me.

After adjusting my cache to a lower number (.3 seemed to work for me), I was able to pull a few more work units. Not enough to last the night, but at least it's something more. I'd rather not deselect the project, because it's one I feel strongly about. Some work, is better then no work, I guess.

It is a shame that the client can't adjust the cache size automatically, if it is set too high. It would help instances like this, or if someone set the value way to high. For each person like myself that checks in on the client, there are probably hundreds that don't. That's a lot of missed work.
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Ingleside
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Re: Not getting enough work units

It is a shame that the client can't adjust the cache size automatically, if it is set too high. It would help instances like this, or if someone set the value way to high. For each person like myself that checks in on the client, there are probably hundreds that don't. That's a lot of missed work.

An auto-adjusting is undesirable, since same computer can be attached to one BOINC-project with 1-day deadline and another with 1 month deadline. Even 10 days-cache is much too large for the 1-day project, client will still try to keep 10 days cached in the other project.

Some projects has variable deadlines, or only for a short time like now in WCG.
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Sekerob
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Re: Not getting enough work units

5.10 allows the manual setting thru the advanced > local preferences menu of an additional buffer. WCG is not recommending it yet as was proven to be correct post 5.10.13's rapid point releases thru 5.10.17. Unless a MUST HAVE large buffer is required, stay with 5.8.15/16. The short deadline jobs should end sometime tomorrow/day after which business will return to normal with the release of FA@H update which should have their 9 days again.

As for the screenshot, running 8 simultaneous jobs, dual quad or 4xC2D is always impressive to see.
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by Sekerob at Aug 7, 2007 4:14:33 PM]
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Re: Not getting enough work units

Ingleside - That does make good sense. In my limited experience with WCG, most everything has had deadlines approxmately equal to each other. Thanks for shedding some light on the subject.

Sekerob - Thanks for the heads up on the version differences. Although I didn't post the screenie to brag, but it is nice to have someone notice. Dual Xeon E5345's. I was averaging around 40 completed units a day on this machine, but this queueing issue has dropped me to 30.
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Re: Not getting enough work units

avaryl - if it makes you feel any better, I'm running a Dual Xeon X5340 and suffering the same 'work starvation' issues crying
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by Former Member at Aug 7, 2007 8:42:39 PM]
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olympic
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Re: Not getting enough work units

I de-selected FAAH from my BOINC profile a few days ago...problem solved! err, avoided! wink
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