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Disappearing WU's w/ a quorum w/o validation

World Community Grid|URL: http://www.worldcommunitygrid.org/; Computer ID: 96645;
B22057_0426_YTMA80-38-3-31-c2--....Pending Val....01/30/2007 02:25....02/01/2007 22:59
B22057_0426_YTMA80-38-3-31-c2--....Pending Val....01/30/2007 02:23....01/30/2007 08:17
B22057_0426_YTMA80-38-3-31-c2--....Pending Val....01/30/2007 02:23....02/04/2007 09:08

10000438-10001051_--....Pending Val....02/04/2007 03:41....02/04/2007 07:27
10000438-10001051_--....Pending Val....02/04/2007 03:41....02/04/2007 07:42
10000438-10001051_--....Pending Val....02/04/2007 03:39....02/04/2007 09:13

... Pending Validation - The result was returned to the server but there have not been enough results for that workunit returned to the server yet for validation to be attempted. The two WU sets above are unusual.
If we cannot force a validation should we not resubmit these WU's for recomp ? Or, will this happen after the 7 day time limit (2/11/07) ?
... The above Work Units disappeared after today's maintenance run 2/7/07 pending validation but not validated ! I do not know if they were validated and stored in the main comparision DB (as part of the maintenance routine) or they were thrown out leaving a hole in the DB.
... These could end up being holes in the completed Database if not fixed (validated) or accepted. Then in expansion, does the system's error checking, catch events such as these and apply autofixes? If an autofix, maybe we wait and watch to see if system works correctly and applies the fix if one exists. ? If no autofix we have information holes in the DB a very serious problem.
... My results did not increase and points are unknown?
...Please advise.
...Weekly maint. schedule completed on Weds 0900 UDT.
[Feb 8, 2007 3:17:39 AM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
keithhenry
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Re: Disappearing WU's w/ a quorum w/o validation

I've never had any WU's disappear in 2+ years. What has happened is that on rare occasions (for me at least), they don't go from Pending Validation to Valid but something else like Inconclusive. Inconclusives can still change to valid after crunched by one or more additional users.
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[Feb 8, 2007 3:25:10 AM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
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Re: Disappearing WU's w/ a quorum w/o validation

I've never had any WU's disappear in 2+ years. ....
Well one has to specifically search for these types. In one's listing they will show up as pending validation after each computer finishes it's WU and then just not get validated after the third is completed. Later, within days, they disappear. So, one doesn't know what's happening unless a specific search is made before they go bye bye. There should have been five other computers wondering what happened or reporting the abnormal scene. But, so far I'm the only one who has noticed or indicated the difficulty in finding such an event when it happens. There could be many such events?
[Feb 8, 2007 3:40:33 AM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Sekerob
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Re: Disappearing WU's w/ a quorum w/o validation

Why a new thread when you reported same here before disappearing. Send an email the Contact_US with the details and surely someone will look into it...... i once had my points increment long after forgotten work. Manual adjustment can be done.
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[Feb 8, 2007 7:54:22 AM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
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Re: Disappearing WU's w/ a quorum w/o validation

Why a new thread when you reported same here before disappearing. Send an email the Contact_US with ....
I just did that. Finding "Contact_US" was not a real easy thing to find. After several attempts I got a hit in "Help" but the email URL was at the bottom of a long page. Frustration. Anyway the new posting was to get attention since I waited for someone to advise me but -- no show. Maybe I'm sometimes too impatient.......but that's life. Thanks for the reply.
--- Oh, I'm not overly concerned about the points stuff but I am concerned about the "DB holes" that may exist. Note my reply to ??? above about difficulty finding such abnormality. These DB holes could contain the information that a researcher is looking for but by quirk of fate did not validate or whatever and therefore is not available -- unknowingly to the researcher. And, here is the important thing -- one would expect a deep computer analysis of the data without any missing info or at least identified. The possible loss of data bytes is the critical issue here.
--- I just recently discovered the problem after almost a year of crunching. I didn't know to look. How many more did I miss? I don't know since they've long since gone ! What happened to the ones I discovered or didn't discover? I just crunch here with hopes I'm doing good for us all.
--- How is it I get so riled up ? Well, here is an example of data lost, a couple of pages, for over 2,000 years that could have advanced civilization by many centuries if not kept from knowing eyes: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/archimedes/palimpsest.html
--- Just like the loss of future drugs, because of the habitat loss in the Brazilian Amazon rain forest, not yet discovered and to be kept from knowing eyes for a couple of bucks and some greedy, rich folks desire for a new castle or luxury cars, etc.
[Feb 8, 2007 4:05:45 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
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Re: Disappearing WU's w/ a quorum w/o validation

The Contact Us link is at the bottom of every page on the site - except for the forums.

Things like this need someone to have a close look at the database, so you can't get as rapid a response as some other questions do.

Don't worry about data getting lost. The scientists send work to WCG in batches, and WCG only return the batch of results when the entire batch is complete and validated.
[Feb 8, 2007 4:12:24 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
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Re: Disappearing WU's w/ a quorum w/o validation

Your correct, I missed them since I rarely use those pages - thanks.
And thanks again for the very rapid response -- less than 10 min's very impressive......your a good guy :>) smile
Like everyone else here
PT
[Feb 8, 2007 4:27:16 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Sekerob
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Re: Disappearing WU's w/ a quorum w/o validation

Some follow up:

1. A Rock / Hard place was indeed identified which could happen during maintenance runs like the one on Feb.04. Your 2 WU's we're validated proper during a clean up run.

2. Because the Result Status pages only maintain complete Quorums up to 4 days after validation, and yours were validated sort of retroactive, they disappeared from view before u could see it.

The extreme delay prevention has been actioned to avoid future occurrences.
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by Sekerob at Feb 12, 2007 10:26:30 PM]
[Feb 12, 2007 10:24:42 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
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