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davecykl
Cruncher Joined: Apr 22, 2020 Post Count: 3 Status: Offline Project Badges: ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
It is very good to see that WCG is now back up and running after prolonged (and, to many of us, entirely unexpected) systems maintenance.
But I have to wonder how many contributors were actually aware in advance that this prolonged downtime was actually planned and scheduled, rather than just yet another unfortunate extended outage, of which WCG has had sadly rather too many in its new-ish home? I understand from the forums (now that they are online again) that apparently an announcement message was sent out in advance to graphical BOINC clients. That is welcome, but many contributors don't use the graphical client, and only run BOINC on 'headless' servers, and so don't ever see such messages. Once it became clear that the infrastructure had indeed "mysteriously" fallen over (including the project website itself - oops) and didn't seem to be coming back after rather too many days, I had to dust off my old Twitter account to see if any sort of status update had maybe been posted. Oh, there actually had been, but I had to scroll past a long and now needlessly pinned post from April 2023(!), as well as a pointlessly self-indulgent promo post (incredibly tone-deaf timing given that the system was still entirely down - maybe wait until systems were non-SNAFU before spending time on ego-stroking?) before I could actually see the important status message! («the slowest of slow hand claps») New social networks Many people now use Twitter (or Facebook) much less nowadays, or have even ceased using these platforms entirely, for various reasons. Would it not be much more in the spirit of open science and genuine community for WCG to now have social network accounts on Mastodon and Bluesky, as well as, or maybe instead of, these other platforms (which have lost considerable numbers of users over the past couple of years)? Can we get a commitment from WCG to do this as soon as possible? Minimal website presence at all times On becoming aware that there seemed to be an extended problem with WCG, naturally you would go to the website to see if there is any sort of status update message. But the website was also entirely offline! That's an absolutely embarrassing decision to have the website completely offline at the same time as back-end server maintenance was taking place. If the front-end website and back-end systems are so tightly coupled together such that this is inevitable, that's an even more embarrassing technical decision, but I acknowledge that sometimes there are legacy technical decisions that we are stuck with. But it would be a fairly trivial task, at the point that the main infrastructure gets powered down, to bring up a basic website on a server elsewhere and redirect the DNS record to point to the temporary site during the maintenance period, or, if there is at least some decoupling, to use web server redirects or proxying to display temporary status content from elsewhere. Yes, it is good (but again, for many contributors, only known with hindsight once the forums were finally back online) that a project member hosted a status page on their own personal homepage, but it is completely unreasonable to expect contributors to even know of, let alone have already bookmarked, some cumbersome random homepage address (1995 and GeoCities called, and although we might have fond memories, that doesn't really hack it for present day expectations of Level of Service). Again, if that was really the best that could have been done (and the information there was adequate, if only you knew of it), it surely would not be beyond the reach of a competent server admin to redirect to that page with DNS and web redirects as needed? Can we request that WCG sets up a hostname status.worldcommunitygrid.org, to point to a webserver hosted outside the main back-end data centre, that, dependent on circumstances, redirects to a formal status page on the main WCG site (when up), to keep contributors appraised of planned downtime, or to a personal homepage/status page during the times when the WCG site requires to be down or is otherwise experiencing problems? Is really is quite embarrassing that what claims to be a large and well-resourced research institute, one which benefits greatly from the computing resources freely and generously given by WCG contributors, really seems incapable of expending the very small amount of work and effort needed to meet the minimum level of communications that one would expect from any sort of professional organisation. I hope that these simple suggestions are received in the spirit intended, and wish WCG itself, and all contributors, all the best for the new year ahead and equal best wishes in helping to move scientific research forward this year, and, of course in future years! |
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Spiderman
Advanced Cruncher United States Joined: Jul 13, 2020 Post Count: 117 Status: Offline Project Badges: ![]() ![]() ![]() |
While more communication is always welcome, I personally saw the Notice on (5) different platforms, some of which were 1-month ahead of time. WCG deserves kudos for letting folks know that far in advance.
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Sgt.Joe
Ace Cruncher USA Joined: Jul 4, 2006 Post Count: 7645 Status: Offline Project Badges: ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
Can we request that WCG sets up a hostname status.worldcommunitygrid.org, to point to a webserver hosted outside the main back-end data centre, that, dependent on circumstances, redirects to a formal status page on the main WCG site (when up), to keep contributors appraised of planned downtime, or to a personal homepage/status page during the times when the WCG site requires to be down or is otherwise experiencing problems? Actually there is a site which is independent of the forums and of the WCG site. It is here. (Go to the "Operational Stas" tab on the right top.) I would prefer the techs use the forums more or push notices to the BOINC client, but they are doing better than they have in the past.Cheers
Sgt. Joe
*Minnesota Crunchers* |
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Dayle Diamond
Senior Cruncher Joined: Jan 31, 2013 Post Count: 452 Status: Offline Project Badges: ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
I, too, would like to see WCG move to social media networks that don't allow hate and misinformation.
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Paul Schlaffer
Senior Cruncher USA Joined: Jun 12, 2005 Post Count: 244 Status: Offline Project Badges: ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
They did the best as one could reasonably expect. There was notifications on the forum, a broadcast to the BOINC client, detailed information on the Jurisica Lab website, and X. There's no need to add yet more minor communication sources.
----------------------------------------I have to say the communication with this was excellent, and hope this continues as the project progresses. Congratulations to the team on a successful upgrade. This scope of project never goes 100% smooth, but this went really well. ![]() “Where an excess of power prevails, property of no sort is duly respected. No man is safe in his opinions, his person, his faculties, or his possessions.” – James Madison (1792) |
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as1981
Cruncher Joined: Dec 3, 2006 Post Count: 49 Status: Offline Project Badges: ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
Congratulations to the team on a successful upgrade. This scope of project never goes 100% smooth, but this went really well. I agree. I think the upgrade has gone well including some good communication. The new status page has been and hopefully will continue to be a useful improvement. |
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Seoulpowergrid
Veteran Cruncher Joined: Apr 12, 2013 Post Count: 817 Status: Offline Project Badges: ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
The status page is now bookmarked so I can easily find it. I'm very glad to have this resource and have checked it often.
----------------------------------------it's difficult to balance the work and I'm very happy they set this up for us. ![]() |
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Link64
Advanced Cruncher Joined: Feb 19, 2021 Post Count: 129 Status: Offline Project Badges: ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
They did the best as one could reasonably expect. There was notifications on the forum, a broadcast to the BOINC client, detailed information on the Jurisica Lab website, and X. There's no need to add yet more minor communication sources. 100% agree. There's nothing to complain about how this outage was announced.![]() |
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ericinboston
Senior Cruncher Joined: Jan 12, 2010 Post Count: 256 Status: Offline Project Badges: ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
On becoming aware that there seemed to be an extended problem with WCG, naturally you would go to the website to see if there is any sort of status update message. But the website was also entirely offline! That's an absolutely embarrassing decision to have the website completely offline at the same time as back-end server maintenance was taking place. If the front-end website and back-end systems are so tightly coupled together such that this is inevitable, that's an even more embarrassing technical decision, but I acknowledge that sometimes there are legacy technical decisions that we are stuck with. But it would be a fairly trivial task, at the point that the main infrastructure gets powered down, to bring up a basic website on a server elsewhere... I 100% agree. I had no idea from my 20+ headless machines that the ENTIRE project and website was going down...and for an extended time. I naturally went to the main website and it was offline. After going to X I read that it was offline. It's 2025 and I can't believe they have the website concreted to the backend servers and/or 0 High Availability and/or 100% of your project in 1 physical datacenter. This is a great example of "all your eggs in 1 basket." WHY WAS THERE NO EMAIL BLAST?! I admit there will be communication that slips through the cracks but no email? Really? The whole point of WCG is that it runs IN THE BACKGROUND and doesn't bother you while it's working. So, no, I'm not going to notice if something goes wrong unless I check my stats periodically and see nothing being done. But ya know what?...me and the other donors at WCG would have seen in their email one morning a message about the disruption. But alas, no...WCG had no foresight to send a simple email alert. And they wonder why participation is so low. ![]() [Edit 1 times, last edit by ericinboston at Jan 24, 2025 1:44:48 PM] |
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Bryn Mawr
Senior Cruncher Joined: Dec 26, 2018 Post Count: 343 Status: Offline Project Badges: ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
On becoming aware that there seemed to be an extended problem with WCG, naturally you would go to the website to see if there is any sort of status update message. But the website was also entirely offline! That's an absolutely embarrassing decision to have the website completely offline at the same time as back-end server maintenance was taking place. If the front-end website and back-end systems are so tightly coupled together such that this is inevitable, that's an even more embarrassing technical decision, but I acknowledge that sometimes there are legacy technical decisions that we are stuck with. But it would be a fairly trivial task, at the point that the main infrastructure gets powered down, to bring up a basic website on a server elsewhere... I 100% agree. I had no idea from my 20+ headless machines that the ENTIRE project and website was going down...and for an extended time. I naturally went to the main website and it was offline. After going to X I read that it was offline. It's 2025 and I can't believe they have the website concreted to the backend servers and/or 0 High Availability and/or 100% of your project in 1 physical datacenter. This is a great example of "all your eggs in 1 basket." WHY WAS THERE NO EMAIL BLAST?! I admit there will be communication that slips through the cracks but no email? Really? The whole point of WCG is that it runs IN THE BACKGROUND and doesn't bother you while it's working. So, no, I'm not going to notice if something goes wrong unless I check my stats periodically and see nothing being done. But ya know what?...me and the other donors at WCG would have seen in their email one morning a message about the disruption. But alas, no...WCG had no foresight to send a simple email alert. And they wonder why participation is so low. You are being unreasonable. You found out what was going on with your second port of call (you can hardly blame WCG for not having prior warning when you were not looking at the comms channels they use) and, in case you had not noticed, putting out an e-mail blast to tens of thousands of volunteers will instantly get you blocked as a spammer - it is not a viable option. |
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