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World Community Grid Forums
Category: Support
Forum: BOINC Agent Support
Thread: NSF funds new model for BOINC |
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Thread Status: Active Total posts in this thread: 12
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Dataman
Ace Cruncher Joined: Nov 16, 2004 Post Count: 4865 Status: Offline Project Badges: 
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Big changes in direction?
----------------------------------------Dr. Anderson's white paper: http://boinc.berkeley.edu/tbd.php BOINC Forum flames: http://boinc.berkeley.edu/dev/forum_thread.ph...;sort_style=6&start=0 Do any of my esteemed colleagues have any comments?   |
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branjo
Master Cruncher Slovakia Joined: Jun 29, 2012 Post Count: 1892 Status: Offline Project Badges: 
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David Anderson Who is (s)he? Creating and operating a VC project is harder than we realized: it requires a combination of resource and skills (Win/Mac programming, sysadmin, DB admin, web design, PR/outreach) English language is one of them not mentioned in quoted set. This is also what I am missing to understand the "article". Funding status... See above I've been mostly MIA from BOINC for the last couple of years, because I've been working full-time on other projects. I apologize for this. With this new funding, I'll be able to devote a good chunk of my time to managing and contributing to BOINC, e.g. setting up a functional release management process. Congrats on your (own) new stream of revenue. I suspect that relatively few current volunteers will use TBD; it's more for new users with wider demographics. So current projects won't lose computing power, and they should get additional power from TBD. Long term, I think something like TBD is our only hope for going from a few 100K volunteers to millions or tens of millions. And such a rising tide will float all of our ships. See above. TBD: a new model for volunteer computing... ha ha ha xa xa xa ja ja ja nice try.  Crunching@Home since January 13 2000. Shrubbing@Home since January 5 2006  [Edit 1 times, last edit by branjo at Jun 8, 2017 7:46:43 PM] |
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Dataman
Ace Cruncher Joined: Nov 16, 2004 Post Count: 4865 Status: Offline Project Badges:
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Sgt.Joe
Ace Cruncher USA Joined: Jul 4, 2006 Post Count: 7846 Status: Offline Project Badges: 
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Thanks Dataman.
----------------------------------------That is certainly an interesting discussion. I happen to like the way BOINC is configured now, because I can pick and choose in which projects I wish to participate. I like this better than being able to participate in an "area" defined by key words. They are probably right when they assert a big part of the BOINC participants are old IT nerdheads (me partially). They are also probably right when they say it is a marketing problem to get and retain participants. This has been mentioned before, but I still believe periodic feedback from the scientists who are running the projects is an important factor in keeping people interested in volunteer computing. Without that feedback, volunteer computing can be as interesting as spending your days watching iron rust. I don't have the answers, but I am pretty sure somebody out there does. I do know this however, when I see my electric bill, I sure hope I am doing somebody, somewhere some eventual good. Cheers
Sgt. Joe
*Minnesota Crunchers* |
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branjo
Master Cruncher Slovakia Joined: Jun 29, 2012 Post Count: 1892 Status: Offline Project Badges:
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Thanks Dataman.
----------------------------------------So, he is probably the right person to move DC via VC to TBD. Using Generations Why and Zed. Yes, they are full of money (and excited) to fund his pocket. I have started with SAH, BOINC hasn't brought anything valuable to me (except of regular computer crashes back in early 2000's), but the path to WCG. Will I miss BOINC if SAH and WCG will remain alone as they are? No. NI! Crunching@Home since January 13 2000. Shrubbing@Home since January 5 2006 [Edit 2 times, last edit by branjo at Jun 8, 2017 8:12:14 PM] |
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KLiK
Master Cruncher Croatia Joined: Nov 13, 2006 Post Count: 3108 Status: Offline Project Badges: 
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Well, he's just saying he can use BOINC idea on mainframe HTC to benefit science...exactly the same idea, low priority CPU allocations (as it's a VC) on mainframe...
----------------------------------------Doesn't concern us, except their adding of WCG will speed up the ECDs! ;) |
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branjo
Master Cruncher Slovakia Joined: Jun 29, 2012 Post Count: 1892 Status: Offline Project Badges:
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KLiK wrote ...Doesn't concern us... Could you, please, specify "us" in your sentence(s)? Crunching@Home since January 13 2000. Shrubbing@Home since January 5 2006 |
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KLiK
Master Cruncher Croatia Joined: Nov 13, 2006 Post Count: 3108 Status: Offline Project Badges:
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KLiK wrote ...Doesn't concern us... Could you, please, specify "us" in your sentence(s)? US, as a members who donate the power to WCG or other projects! D.P. Andreson is talking about making BOINC script to use on mainframe data-centers & use all of their power for good...we don't have such clusters at home, so we're not going to be influenced by this new project! It's main goal is to use big data centers that don't have enough jobs on their disposal...& as soon as some high rating project ends & clears some 20 or 200 processors, a script from BOINC can boot up new science for a data that that university of company wants to use!   |
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Former Member
Cruncher Joined: May 22, 2018 Post Count: 0 Status: Offline |
D.P. Andreson is talking about making BOINC script to use on mainframe data-centers & use all of their power for good...we don't have such clusters at home, so we're not going to be influenced by this new project! It's main goal is to use big data centers that don't have enough jobs on their disposal...& as soon as some high rating project ends & clears some 20 or 200 processors, a script from BOINC can boot up new science for a data that that university of company wants to use! First BOINC isn't a script, it's an executable. Second, it sounds to me like the intent isn't to run BOINC on an HTC/HPC cluster but to provide a back-end to the cluster where volunteer computers can be accessed as though they were additional nodes to the existing cluster. Scientists using the cluster wouldn't notice any difference other than they can run more work faster. I think Dr. Anderson feels this will bring volunteer computing into the environment with which scientists are already familiar instead of having to build one-off BOINC environments and all of the things that entails. It will be interesting to see how the details are worked out. I think this model will turn away volunteers who like to know exactly what project they are contributing to and who also like to interact with the researchers. The current BOINC model has allowed labs with small budgets to get computing power by building single host BOINC platforms. In Dr. Anderson's model, scientists will still have to pay for the HTC/HPC cluster time (which is expensive) but will have access to more computing power potentially (depends on volunteer adoption). I hope both models co-exist for some time.... |
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KLiK
Master Cruncher Croatia Joined: Nov 13, 2006 Post Count: 3108 Status: Offline Project Badges:
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D.P. Andreson is talking about making BOINC script to use on mainframe data-centers & use all of their power for good...we don't have such clusters at home, so we're not going to be influenced by this new project! It's main goal is to use big data centers that don't have enough jobs on their disposal...& as soon as some high rating project ends & clears some 20 or 200 processors, a script from BOINC can boot up new science for a data that that university of company wants to use! First BOINC isn't a script, it's an executable. Second, it sounds to me like the intent isn't to run BOINC on an HTC/HPC cluster but to provide a back-end to the cluster where volunteer computers can be accessed as though they were additional nodes to the existing cluster. Scientists using the cluster wouldn't notice any difference other than they can run more work faster. I think Dr. Anderson feels this will bring volunteer computing into the environment with which scientists are already familiar instead of having to build one-off BOINC environments and all of the things that entails. It will be interesting to see how the details are worked out. I think this model will turn away volunteers who like to know exactly what project they are contributing to and who also like to interact with the researchers. The current BOINC model has allowed labs with small budgets to get computing power by building single host BOINC platforms. In Dr. Anderson's model, scientists will still have to pay for the HTC/HPC cluster time (which is expensive) but will have access to more computing power potentially (depends on volunteer adoption). I hope both models co-exist for some time.... Read again here: http://boinc.berkeley.edu/tbd.php TBD is just for new demographics & easier to use BOINC. To quote: "I suspect that relatively few current volunteers will use TBD; it's more for new users with wider demographics. So current projects won't lose computing power, and they should get additional power from TBD. Long term, I think something like TBD is our only hope for going from a few 100K volunteers to millions or tens of millions. And such a rising tide will float all of our ships." Main difference is about making BOINC portable to HTC/HPC & making sure some labs run their facilities at 100% of time, when work is not allocated.  Will it also be on some paying cluster? That I do not know. |
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