| Index | Recent Threads | Unanswered Threads | Who's Active | Guidelines | Search |
| World Community Grid Forums
|
| No member browsing this thread |
|
Thread Status: Active Total posts in this thread: 23
|
|
| Author |
|
|
Former Member
Cruncher Joined: May 22, 2018 Post Count: 0 Status: Offline |
I do not have a Sony Vaio but I too have an "ethical dilemma".
I certainly have no problem with the BOINC/WCG software coming preinstalled however the important issue at hand for me seems to be "choice". Is the software set up to automatically run? From the quick research I did (please correct me if I am wrong) it seems that several Sony Vaio users have complained about BOINC running and using up their resources without their permission. That takes away a person's choice to contribute and if it is set up like that then I certainly can not agree with that practice. Running BOINC is completely different from having Symantec or any other "bloatware" running simply because BOINC is a very resource intensive process, it probably reduces the lifespan of the machine and it does cause an increase in electrical costs. These risks and costs should not be forced on the consumer without their consent. It definitely would be a good thing if more computer users decide to contribute to WCG and other BOINC projects but to choose for them is distinctly wrong from an ethical standpoint. I am sure that there will be many people in this forum and in general who disagree with my opinion and see no ethical violation with this practice because BOINC/WCG is a worthy cause and it benefits society and the entire human race however we can not use results to validate the injustice of taking away choice ( even if it is a seemingly insignificant choice). Should we compel everyone with a computer to crunch for WCG and other BOINC projects? Should we force everyone to contribute a portion of their income to worthy charities? Who decides which charities and causes are worthy and which ones are not? To sum up, the power of "choice" is important and to take it away from someone is to make that person a "slave" to your decision and is definitely morally wrong. P.S. There is a YouTube playlist called Justice which is Professor Michael Sandel's class lectures from Harvard that I am currently watching and find quite interesting and insightful. The correct moral and ethical thing to do is not always as simple as it appears. Here's the link if anyone decides to choose to view it http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL30C13C91CFFEFEA6&feature=plcp |
||
|
|
Coleslaw
Veteran Cruncher USA Joined: Mar 29, 2007 Post Count: 1343 Status: Offline Project Badges:
|
From my understanding, current Vaio systems require you to click yes to participate. I don't remember where I read it, but IIRC systems that were first launched weren't set up well and had some of these misunderstandings. I have read many forums with this issue and noticed one individual posted in many with the same exact statement/argument/topic highly designed to fan conspiracy. However, the issue I have and agree with Hypernova on is the issue with team selection. SONY obviously isn't giving them choice in the matter before work units are downloaded. I find their setup to be quick and easy but still lacking in "choice". You must also keep in mind that very few of the people online will admit being wrong. Very few of the people will read what they are clicking on. Most will never recall accepting all the toolbar installations in their system and therefore probably don't remember click "yes" to running WCG/BOINC.
----------------------------------------![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
||
|
|
BladeD
Ace Cruncher USA Joined: Nov 17, 2004 Post Count: 28976 Status: Offline Project Badges:
|
I don't really care, but I do find it interesting that a cruncher that does not use Sony Vaio products has an 'ethical dilemma' with the contract that WCG made with Sony regarding pre-installing what others would generally call 'bloatware' on Sony's products. It's no different than Symantec loading NAV on HP products. Not your call. I didn't read it that way. He's questioning what options Sony is giving its customers and Sony taking credit for their work. |
||
|
|
Hypernova
Master Cruncher Audaces Fortuna Juvat ! Vaud - Switzerland Joined: Dec 16, 2008 Post Count: 1908 Status: Offline Project Badges:
|
I didn't read it that way. He's questioning what options Sony is giving its customers and Sony taking credit for their work. BladeD, you perfectly expressed in a nutshell my point. ![]() |
||
|
|
Former Member
Cruncher Joined: May 22, 2018 Post Count: 0 Status: Offline |
Would Sony not have been convinced of starting the program, the software [initially not *activated*] which IS opt-in, that collective contribution of spare CPU cycles would not have amounted to 1225 CPU years as of now.
----------------------------------------But, 890 members, 10 retired to register maybe under own name [residual active I cant see]? How many units were sold and the option was taken NOT to select participation? No choice? There was and it was for the very largest part waved, so is my assessment. Hope there's still a menu entry somewhere of the bloatware catalog that allows to still choose to opt-in at a later date, at the very least entice the owners to have a second look at what WCG does. --//-- [Edit 2 times, last edit by Former Member at Dec 8, 2011 9:49:07 AM] |
||
|
|
Former Member
Cruncher Joined: May 22, 2018 Post Count: 0 Status: Offline |
The question is: Does Sony give to every purchaser of a computer that has WCG pre-installed, in the setup phase a clear choice either to crunch with results going to Sony Vaio Team, or to set up an account at WCG in the purchaser name and let him collect the points, results etc. on his account. He can then become member of the Sony Vaio Team if he wishes. The process must be very clear. I share this view, and that is, the purchaser (of the Sony VAIO computer) should be made to be aware of the details (gridCompany: WCG, accountName: Sony Vaio [or purhcaser's choice]) surrounding crunching at WCG -- a process that should begin only with an informed and explicit consent from the purchaser. My view is that, in the long haul, a cruncher who comes to WCG by way of an informed and explicit choice, under an account of his/her choice, under a team of his/her choice - is worth more than 100 crunchers who were otherwise 'caught'.-- snip from Hypernova [Dec 3, 2011 3:59:32 PM] post > original post ; |
||
|
|
Former Member
Cruncher Joined: May 22, 2018 Post Count: 0 Status: Offline |
I've worked at a PC Helpdesk for a number years now, and I can tell you with certainty that the average user is ignorant in the extreme.
The average user, having purchased a new PC, will trust the person or company that they purchased that PC from implicitly. If you pre-install something on the machine you sell them, and then ask if they want to run it, their response will be "Well, you installed it, it must be good/necessary." and then they'll say yes. It won't be until later, when they realize what the program actually does, that they have second thoughts. At that point, the user may feel that they've been conned into the deal and have a very negative viewpoint of both the program and the vendor that sold them the PC. |
||
|
|
knreed
Former World Community Grid Tech Joined: Nov 8, 2004 Post Count: 4504 Status: Offline Project Badges:
|
I want to comment on this thread to make sure that everyone is debating based on facts.
1) Sony provides people who purchase a US VAIO the option during the OOBE (OOBE is the Out of The Box Experience - i.e. the screens you see the first time you start a new computer) process to participate or not participate in World Community Grid. The end user is 100% in control of this decision. Sony includes material that briefly explains what the program is. They are not default opted in. 2) Users who opt to participate are connected under the Sony VAIO name. 3) Users have the same ability to detach and reattach with a different member name using the same mechanisms that everyone here does. |
||
|
|
KWSN - A Shrubbery
Master Cruncher Joined: Jan 8, 2006 Post Count: 1585 Status: Offline |
I want to comment on this thread to make sure that everyone is debating based on facts. We have never let facts stand in our way before, no reason to start now... ![]() ![]() Distributed computing volunteer since September 27, 2000 |
||
|
|
Former Member
Cruncher Joined: May 22, 2018 Post Count: 0 Status: Offline |
With knreed's [Dec 8, 2011 11:45:29 PM] post, WCG can look forward to new crunchers who have a good chance of crunching around WCG for quite some time. If ever the preparations for the rolling of the Welcome mat may have momentarily been held, all the reasons are now firmly in place to resume that rolling!
P.S: Say, WCG, how about a warm welcoming treat/package for them new crunchers? How about double the usual points for the first 100 resultsReturned (or something like that) as part of that package? Shouldn't hurt, would it? ; |
||
|
|
|