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littlepeaks
Veteran Cruncher USA Joined: Apr 28, 2007 Post Count: 748 Status: Offline Project Badges:
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What I find most interesting is how one would fully embrace the concept of WCG, while at the same time reject the scientific consensus on man-influenced climate change and the resulting negative effects. There is no "scientific consensus", just a "political consensus". Consensus is not how science works. Many, many climate-scientists do not agree on "man-influenced climate change and the resulting negative effects." And, yes, crunch on. |
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retsof
Former Community Advisor USA Joined: Jul 31, 2005 Post Count: 6824 Status: Offline Project Badges:
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http://www.wind-works.org/articles/BreathLife.html
----------------------------------------Wind Energy -- The Breath of Life or the Kiss of Death: Contemporary Wind Mortality Rates by Paul Gipe An edited version of this article appeared in the Vol. 14 No. 4 – Autumn 2001 edition of WindStats Newsletter. Statistics on the number of deaths in the industry have been updated to fall 2009 and are reflected in the database. The article has not been changed in response to the new data. (excerpts) In the mid-1990s, 14 men had been killed on wind turbines or working with wind energy. Since then six more have died, including the first member of the public, a parachutist who literally flew into a turbine in Germany. One half of the deaths have occurred on or around turbines of the size typically installed during the great California wind boom of the mid-1980s. Still, 7 have been killed working with larger turbines. Tragically, at least 3 people have been killed working with small turbines. These deaths dramatically skew the mortality rate because small turbines account for a minuscule amount of worldwide wind generation. The preponderance of those killed worldwide were Americans; 12 U.S. citizens, and one Canadian. Germany, despite the phenomenal growth of it wind industry since 1990, has one of the lowest mortality rates of the four nations where deaths have occurred, 0.07 deaths per TWh. The German rate includes the parachutist who, in her first unassisted jump, hit a wind turbine on the island of Fehmarn. In doing so she became the first women killed by wind energy and the first member of the public killed. However, it's important to note that though she was a member of the public, she was not a passerby, such as a person who walks or drives by a wind turbine. Her death is more akin to that of a suicide from a jump off a bridge or tall building. (This is a critical distinction. In the two decades I've tracked this data, no passerby has been injured by wind energy.) The mortality rate in the USA, where all 13 deaths in North America occurred, is twice that of the international average. As is the mortality rate in the Netherlands. How does wind's mortality rate compare with that from other energy sources? Unfortunately, there is no simple answer. Part of the problem is that statistics on mortality rates for the full fuel cycle of coal, for example, are not readily available. And where available they use different units. Yet, it appears that the current mortality rate of wind energy of 0.15 deaths per TWh is roughly equivalent to that of mining, processing, and burning of coal to generate electricity according to some researchers. (This data doesn't include increases in mortality from the air pollution that results from burning coal.) Data from other researchers indicates that wind's mortality rate is about half that for the occupational mortality rate for coal. The data clearly indicates that the wind industry will have to do a better job at improving safety if it wants to live up to its promise of being clean, green, and--benign.
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----------------------------------------Work+GPU i7 8700 12threads School i7 4770 8threads Default+GPU Ryzen 7 3700X 16threads Ryzen 7 3800X 16 threads Ryzen 9 3900X 24threads Home i7 3540M 4threads50% [Edit 2 times, last edit by retsof at Mar 15, 2010 1:34:55 AM] |
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retsof
Former Community Advisor USA Joined: Jul 31, 2005 Post Count: 6824 Status: Offline Project Badges:
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Met Office appears to change famous hockey stick graph. Previous complaints were about the blade trending up. NOW, it's the whole handle, instead of the blade.
----------------------------------------http://posterous.com/getfile/files.posterous....t_11.4.png.scaled.500.jpg March 13, 2010 Full Text: New UK Met Office climate study updating IPCC 2007 report (via @TIME @climatecentral @ddimick) ![]()
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Former Member
Cruncher Joined: May 22, 2018 Post Count: 0 Status: Offline |
What I find most interesting is how one would fully embrace the concept of WCG, while at the same time reject the scientific consensus on man-influenced climate change and the resulting negative effects. There is no "scientific consensus", just a "political consensus". Consensus is not how science works. Many, many climate-scientists do not agree on "man-influenced climate change and the resulting negative effects." And, yes, crunch on. Wrong again, sorry. We have some lovely consolation prizes. Your "many many" is <3%. ![]() http://www.skepticalscience.com/global-warming-scientific-consensus.htm Figure 1: Response to the survey question "Do you think human activity is a significant contributing factor in changing mean global temperatures?" (Doran 2009) General public data come from a 2008 Gallup poll. Most striking is the divide between expert climate scientists (97.4%) and the general public (58%). The paper concludes "It seems that the debate on the authenticity of global warming and the role played by human activity is largely nonexistent among those who understand the nuances and scientific basis of long-term climate processes. The challenge, rather, appears to be how to effectively communicate this fact to policy makers and to a public that continues to mistakenly perceive debate among scientists." [Edit 2 times, last edit by Former Member at Mar 15, 2010 2:33:29 PM] |
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David Autumns
Ace Cruncher UK Joined: Nov 16, 2004 Post Count: 11062 Status: Offline Project Badges:
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Eso this is not a matter of opinion this is a matter of science
----------------------------------------Ask Copernicus if the Sun was the centre of the Solar System and he would have said yes. But what was the consensus of the day? ![]() |
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David Autumns
Ace Cruncher UK Joined: Nov 16, 2004 Post Count: 11062 Status: Offline Project Badges:
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It looks like the Advertising Standards Agency do have teeth after all
----------------------------------------http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/environment/article7061162.ece TWO government advertisements that use nursery rhymes to warn people of the dangers of climate change have been banned by the Advertising Standards Authority (ASA) for exaggerating the potential harm. The adverts, commissioned by Ed Miliband, the energy secretary, used the rhymes to suggest that Britain faces an inevitable increase in storms, floods and heat waves unless greenhouse gas emissions are brought under control. The ASA has ruled that the claims made in the newspaper adverts were not supported by solid science and has told the Department of Energy and Climate Change (DECC) that they should not be published again. It has also referred a television commercial to the broadcast regulator, Ofcom, for potentially breaching a prohibition on political advertising. To paraphrase the ASA Please stop the propaganda and fearmongering Mr Miliband (n.b. "the claims made in the newspaper adverts were not supported by solid science") ![]() |
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David Autumns
Ace Cruncher UK Joined: Nov 16, 2004 Post Count: 11062 Status: Offline Project Badges:
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Dear retsof
----------------------------------------Sometimes your posts are genuinely funny First there is no reason why anyone should have to die during the erection or manufacture of a wind turbine none at all. You then go on to suggest that Wind Turbines are inherently life threatening because an unfortunate soul jumped out of the door of a fully functioning aeroplane many thousands of feet above a wind farm armed against gravity and the rotating blades with only a sheet of ripstop nylon packed tightly in a rucksack on their back and because of this tragic accident Wind Turbines are inherently dangerous to life and limb and this is your cogent argument against Wind Turbines and in favour of Nuclear Power (surely more in favour of an entry in the 2010 Darwin Awards) It is precisely the fact that Humans are want for such accidents that means we should not continue to gather up thinly distributed Uranium concentrate it and bring together in one very hot spot a quantity that goes "Critical" and then claim to faultlessly control this runaway process with the result of leaving behind a 100,000 year plus toxic legacy and then have the cheek to claim it is clean, safe and environmentally friendly In the tragic accident involving the Wind Turbine just one very very unlucky and unfortunate person was affected. In the tragic accident of Chernobyl how many people died and continue to be affected since that disaster on April 26th 1986? Dave ![]() |
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Former Member
Cruncher Joined: May 22, 2018 Post Count: 0 Status: Offline |
TWO government advertisements that use nursery rhymes to warn people of the dangers of climate change have been banned by the Advertising Standards Authority (ASA) for exaggerating the potential harm. Once again, DA, you quote politics not science. We are all awaiting your revelations regarding the science. Waiting.................... |
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retsof
Former Community Advisor USA Joined: Jul 31, 2005 Post Count: 6824 Status: Offline Project Badges:
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In the tragic accident of Chernobyl how many people died and continue to be affected since that disaster on April 26th 1986? several ... Dave an accident caused by defeating their own safety precautions
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Former Member
Cruncher Joined: May 22, 2018 Post Count: 0 Status: Offline |
Posted something similar a few weeks ago.
Merchants of Doubt: How a Handful of Scientists Obscured the Truth on Issues from Tobacco Smoke to Global Warming (Hardcover) http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1596916109?i...p;creativeASIN=1596916109 The U.S. scientific community has long led the world in research on such areas as public health, environmental science, and issues affecting quality of life. Our scientists have produced landmark studies on the dangers of DDT, tobacco smoke, acid rain, and global warming. But at the same time, a small yet potent subset of this community leads the world in vehement denial of these dangers. Merchants of Doubt tells the story of how a loose-knit group of high-level scientists and scientific advisers, with deep connections in politics and industry, ran effective campaigns to mislead the public and deny well-established scientific knowledge over four decades. Remarkably, the same individuals surface repeatedly?some of the same figures who have claimed that the science of global warming is "not settled" denied the truth of studies linking smoking to lung cancer, coal smoke to acid rain, and CFCs to the ozone hole. "Doubt is our product," wrote one tobacco executive. These "experts" supplied it. Naomi Oreskes and Erik M. Conway, historians of science, roll back the rug on this dark corner of the American scientific community, showing how ideology and corporate interests, aided by a too-compliant media, have skewed public understanding of some of the most pressing issues of our era. |
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